<< Now, BENEATH I would say takes place over the course of only a few days,
BUT how long was the period supposed to be between PLANET and BENEATH? >>


I'm guessing at least a year, maybe more.

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 3:55 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] The Apes tv series - quality

In a message dated 10/11/01 7:03:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time, veetus@... writes:

 What I understand is that the Galen intros were done specifically for the ABC network, so maybe there's rights issues. I could've taped them way back when but I figures why bother? Slap me, Ken!

                                                                         - - - - Jeff

I read someplace that the make-up wasn't very good for those.  What's the story?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlOoops!  Hey, Jeff Krueger.  I just read the acknowledgements for Brian Pendreigh's "The Legend of the Planet of the Apes" and it seems you ARE mentioned after all, although he has you down as 'Jack' Krueger.  'LordTZer0,' Alan Maxwell, Dave Ballard, Alexander Ruiz (remember him?), Luiz Saulo Adami, Terry Hokens, and Brian Penikas are all mentioned for thanks.   So, that's cleared up.

Pendreigh is a professional film journalist, and I agree with his views and attitudes toward the POTA films.  For instance, he calls BENEATH 'a mess.'  That it sure is.  And he knocks Eric Greene, saying "It certainly is possible to read too much into the film[s]."

And he's done his research, and here's something that I don't think Krueger hasn't read in Starlog.

Who came up with the Statue of Liberty ending?  I think we've all pretty much decided that it was Rod Serling.  Mort Abrahams has been quoted as saying "The concept was Rod's."  But this Pendreigh guy has dug up some interesting artifacts.   Remember the story Jacobs told in 1972 to 'Cinefantastique' about being in a delicatessen in Burbank, across the street from Warner Brothers, having lunch with Blake Edwards, and as they go to pay for their sandwiches, they look up and see a picture of the Statue of Liberty, look at each other and say, "Rosebud"?   Well, Pendreigh says Mort Abrahams never heard that story, and he contacted Edwards about it.  Edwards laughed when he heard that story, and says, "That's the biggest. . .most elaborate. . . lie that could be made!"  And Blake Edwards says the Statue of Liberty ending "was a combined effort between myself and an artist called Don Peters."

Who is Don Peters?  Well, Pendreigh was able to track him down.  He's now in his eighties, lives outside L.A., and was once an artist at Disney. (He later turned screenwriter and wrote "The Naked Prey.")   These are some quotes from this Don Peters:

"It's the first time anybody has ever asked me anything about what I did on this film [PLANET]."

"My involvement was, Blake Edwards called me one day. . . and I worked on it for about a year."

Pendreigh writes:  "Peters reckons he produced more than a hundred paintings for 'Planet of the Apes.'  'I had a free hand,' he says.  He gave the apes tanks and helicopters and at the end of the long trek he thought it might be a good idea if they stumbled out of the mist and found a statue of an ape.  He remembers a meeting with Edwards, Jacobs, Serling and Jack Warner.  Warner Brothers liked the idea of the film, and his designs, but the budget was prohibitive."

Now this next part you'll find very interesting, Jeff....

"'What happened in the final analysis was Blake backed out of the deal,' says Peters.  He confirms that the relationship with Jacobs was not an easy one.  'Arthur Jacobs was a paranoid schizophrenic. He used to sweat all the time, which should have been a tip-off.'  Peters remembers telling Jacobs that he had heard Picasso wanted to make an animation film.  Jacobs went to see Picasso, when he was in France, but was turned away at the gate.  'He blamed me for it,' says Peters.  'He was a total neurotic.'  Most of Peters' ideas for 'Planet of the Apes' never made it before the cameras.  And the Statue of Liberty ending?  'It was my idea,' he says.  'At least three of the paintings I did were of the Statue of Liberty.'  And no one asked him to do it?  Serling?  Edwards?  Jacobs?  'It was my idea. . . I never asked for credits.'"

So, what does everyone think of that story?  I don't know.  It may be true.  Why would this eighty-year-old guy, contacted out of the blue, lie?

Anyway, as I've said, this book is a must-have for a serious APES' fan.  I wish I had a scanner.  One of Peters' paintings of the Statue of Liberty ending is reproduced in it.  Maybe Alan Maxwell can do that for us? (hint, hint)

-- Rory  <.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 8:52:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, LordTZer0@... writes:

<<  Now, BENEATH I would say takes place over the course of only a few days,
BUT how long was the period supposed to be between PLANET and BENEATH? >>


I'm guessing at least a year, maybe more.

Well, I don't think that's possible.  I'd say only two weeks at most.  Why?  How long do you think it took Taylor and Nova to ride from the Statue of Liberty to the area near New York City where Taylor gets captured?  A couple days I would think, maybe not even that!  Now, how long is Nova supposed to be roaming the desert on that horse with no name?  (I'll bet it felt good for her to get out of the rain.)  Probably only another fews days before she stumbles across Brent and his crashed ship.  Then it probably only took another couple days for them to ride to Ape City.

Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at the end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy?  And there were only engaged in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH.  And in the same amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the mutants in the Forbidden Zone.

This is yet another reason why BENEATH is a mess, and is best thought of as "based" on the first film.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 2:08:14 AM Central Daylight Time, veetus@... writes:

Thanks for proving my point

Later.
Al

Exactly what the hell is / was his point??

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 8:40:47 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@... writes:

Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at the end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy?  And there were only engaged in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH.  And in the same amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the mutants in the Forbidden Zone.

Well, about the being tried for heresy thing....It is discussed in the novelization of BENEATH (pg. 42) Here's what it says: Cornelius started "But that is appalling! When Zira and I first unlocked the secrets of the Forbidden Zone, you intervened at our trial for heresy." (Zaius says) "I know." "The price we payed for our freedom was the vow to you never to disclose our discovery that Man evolved from the Ape...." As to why they left those lines on the cutting room floor, one can only guess...

The marriage thing...well perhaps they decided that if they could have been tried (and hanged together) they might as well just take the leap and get married. Who knows, but I'm sure even in the Apes society marriage can be done on a whim....But they were engaged so maybe the being in trouble with the authorities thing was the thing that made them do it...All pure speculation on my part...

And about the soldiers being captured... Maybe they were on a mission to find out if more like Taylor (intelligent humans that is) existed, so if they did, they could be eliminated...before they'd become a threat to the Apes as Taylor was to their society. Their searching for "mutants" led them to being captured by real mutants.

<.html

.htmlKen I was wondering the 4 dvds in the tv set do the individule boxes have diffrent photos? or do the look like the box with the two on horse back? Bryan<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 11:09:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at the end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy?  And there were only engaged in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH.  And in the same amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the mutants in the Forbidden Zone.

Well, about the being tried for heresy thing....It is discussed in the novelization of BENEATH (pg. 42) Here's what it says: Cornelius started "But that is appalling! When Zira and I first unlocked the secrets of the Forbidden Zone, you intervened at our trial for heresy." (Zaius says) "I know." "The price we payed for our freedom was the vow to you never to disclose our discovery that Man evolved from the Ape...." As to why they left those lines on the cutting room floor, one can only guess...

The marriage thing...well perhaps they decided that if they could have been tried (and hanged together) they might as well just take the leap and get married. Who knows, but I'm sure even in the Apes society marriage can be done on a whim....But they were engaged so maybe the being in trouble with the authorities thing was the thing that made them do it...All pure speculation on my part...

And about the soldiers being captured... Maybe they were on a mission to find out if more like Taylor (intelligent humans that is) existed, so if they did, they could be eliminated...before they'd become a threat to the Apes as Taylor was to their society. Their searching for "mutants" led them to being captured by real mutants.




I'm not arguing as to the whys of the thing, just that it's an awful lot to have happened in what must have been a VERY short period of time between PLANET and BENEATH, because just how long could Nova have been out there alone in the Forbidden Zone?

As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 11:40:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Kay53531@... writes:

Ken I was wondering the 4 dvds in the tv set do the individule boxes have diffrent photos? or do the look like the box with the two on horse back? Bryan

I know you asked Ken this question, but I can't help saying, "How's he supposed to know?"   Ken doesn't work for Fox anymore.  Anyway, Bryan, the DVDs will be out soon and then we'll all know what pictures are on the individual covers!   And knowing Fox, I'm sure some won't be pleased, others will, and most won't care.

-- Rory<.html

.html Sorry Bryan,
I can't help you with that one. As I left Fox some time ago, I have not been privy to or involved in the development for the release of the TV series on DVD.
Best,
KEN

Kay53531@... wrote:

Ken I was wondering the 4 dvds in the tv set do the individule boxes have diffrent photos? or do the look like the box with the two on horse back? Bryan

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

 

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to fly???
Here we go again..........
 

-KEN

 
I'm not arguing as to the whys of the thing, just that it's an awful lot to have happened in what must have been a VERY short period of time between PLANET and BENEATH, because just how long could Nova have been out there alone in the Forbidden Zone?

As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory

<.html

In a message dated 10/11/01 11:52:00 PM, kentaylor@... writes:

<< And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the time
to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's ship when
most astronauts spend months, even years training to fly???
Here we go again..........>>

That's the real question, huh?

Here's my theory on how they retrieved the ship: it never sank to begin with.
What Taylor, Landon and Dodge saw was just an illusion cast by the mutants to
confuse them even further.

As far as how they learned to fly it, I have no clue.

Anyone else got any?

Matt

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 6:21 PM

Subject: [pota] The Legend of the Planet of the Apes

Ooops!  Hey, Jeff Krueger.  I just read the acknowledgements for Brian Pendreigh's "The Legend of the Planet of the Apes" and it seems you ARE mentioned after all, although he has you down as 'Jack' Krueger.  'LordTZer0,' Alan Maxwell, Dave Ballard, Alexander Ruiz (remember him?), Luiz Saulo Adami, Terry Hokens, and Brian Penikas are all mentioned for thanks.   So, that's cleared up.

Pendreigh is a professional film journalist, and I agree with his views and attitudes toward the POTA films.  For instance, he calls BENEATH 'a mess.'  That it sure is.  And he knocks Eric Greene, saying "It certainly is possible to read too much into the film[s]."

And he's done his research, and here's something that I don't think Krueger hasn't read in Starlog.

Who came up with the Statue of Liberty ending?  I think we've all pretty much decided that it was Rod Serling.  Mort Abrahams has been quoted as saying "The concept was Rod's."  But this Pendreigh guy has dug up some interesting artifacts.   Remember the story Jacobs told in 1972 to 'Cinefantastique' about being in a delicatessen in Burbank, across the street from Warner Brothers, having lunch with Blake Edwards, and as they go to pay for their sandwiches, they look up and see a picture of the Statue of Liberty, look at each other and say, "Rosebud"?   Well, Pendreigh says Mort Abrahams never heard that story, and he contacted Edwards about it.  Edwards laughed when he heard that story, and says, "That's the biggest. . .most elaborate. . . lie that could be made!"  And Blake Edwards says the Statue of Liberty ending "was a combined effort between myself and an artist called Don Peters."

Who is Don Peters?  Well, Pendreigh was able to track him down.  He's now in his eighties, lives outside L.A., and was once an artist at Disney. (He later turned screenwriter and wrote "The Naked Prey.")   These are some quotes from this Don Peters:

"It's the first time anybody has ever asked me anything about what I did on this film [PLANET]."

"My involvement was, Blake Edwards called me one day. . . and I worked on it for about a year."

Pendreigh writes:  "Peters reckons he produced more than a hundred paintings for 'Planet of the Apes.'  'I had a free hand,' he says.  He gave the apes tanks and helicopters and at the end of the long trek he thought it might be a good idea if they stumbled out of the mist and found a statue of an ape.  He remembers a meeting with Edwards, Jacobs, Serling and Jack Warner.  Warner Brothers liked the idea of the film, and his designs, but the budget was prohibitive."

Now this next part you'll find very interesting, Jeff....

"'What happened in the final analysis was Blake backed out of the deal,' says Peters.  He confirms that the relationship with Jacobs was not an easy one.  'Arthur Jacobs was a paranoid schizophrenic. He used to sweat all the time, which should have been a tip-off.'  Peters remembers telling Jacobs that he had heard Picasso wanted to make an animation film.  Jacobs went to see Picasso, when he was in France, but was turned away at the gate.  'He blamed me for it,' says Peters.  'He was a total neurotic.'  Most of Peters' ideas for 'Planet of the Apes' never made it before the cameras.  And the Statue of Liberty ending?  'It was my idea,' he says.  'At least three of the paintings I did were of the Statue of Liberty.'  And no one asked him to do it?  Serling?  Edwards?  Jacobs?  'It was my idea. . . I never asked for credits.'"

So, what does everyone think of that story?  I don't know.  It may be true.  Why would this eighty-year-old guy, contacted out of the blue, lie?

Anyway, as I've said, this book is a must-have for a serious APES' fan.  I wish I had a scanner.  One of Peters' paintings of the Statue of Liberty ending is reproduced in it.  Maybe Alan Maxwell can do that for us? (hint, hint)

-- Rory  

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 6:21 PM

Subject: [pota] The Legend of the Planet of the Apes

Ooops!  Hey, Jeff Krueger.  I just read the acknowledgements for Brian Pendreigh's "The Legend of the Planet of the Apes" and it seems you ARE mentioned after all, although he has you down as 'Jack' Krueger.  'LordTZer0,' Alan Maxwell, Dave Ballard, Alexander Ruiz (remember him?), Luiz Saulo Adami, Terry Hokens, and Brian Penikas are all mentioned for thanks.   So, that's cleared up.

Pendreigh is a professional film journalist, and I agree with his views and attitudes toward the POTA films.  For instance, he calls BENEATH 'a mess.'  That it sure is.  And he knocks Eric Greene, saying "It certainly is possible to read too much into the film[s]."

And he's done his research, and here's something that I don't think Krueger hasn't read in Starlog.

Who came up with the Statue of Liberty ending?  I think we've all pretty much decided that it was Rod Serling.  Mort Abrahams has been quoted as saying "The concept was Rod's."  But this Pendreigh guy has dug up some interesting artifacts.   Remember the story Jacobs told in 1972 to 'Cinefantastique' about being in a delicatessen in Burbank, across the street from Warner Brothers, having lunch with Blake Edwards, and as they go to pay for their sandwiches, they look up and see a picture of the Statue of Liberty, look at each other and say, "Rosebud"?   Well, Pendreigh says Mort Abrahams never heard that story, and he contacted Edwards about it.  Edwards laughed when he heard that story, and says, "That's the biggest. . .most elaborate. . . lie that could be made!"  And Blake Edwards says the Statue of Liberty ending "was a combined effort between myself and an artist called Don Peters."

Who is Don Peters?  Well, Pendreigh was able to track him down.  He's now in his eighties, lives outside L.A., and was once an artist at Disney. (He later turned screenwriter and wrote "The Naked Prey.")   These are some quotes from this Don Peters:

"It's the first time anybody has ever asked me anything about what I did on this film [PLANET]."

"My involvement was, Blake Edwards called me one day. . . and I worked on it for about a year."

Pendreigh writes:  "Peters reckons he produced more than a hundred paintings for 'Planet of the Apes.'  'I had a free hand,' he says.  He gave the apes tanks and helicopters and at the end of the long trek he thought it might be a good idea if they stumbled out of the mist and found a statue of an ape.  He remembers a meeting with Edwards, Jacobs, Serling and Jack Warner.  Warner Brothers liked the idea of the film, and his designs, but the budget was prohibitive."

Now this next part you'll find very interesting, Jeff....

"'What happened in the final analysis was Blake backed out of the deal,' says Peters.  He confirms that the relationship with Jacobs was not an easy one.  'Arthur Jacobs was a paranoid schizophrenic. He used to sweat all the time, which should have been a tip-off.'  Peters remembers telling Jacobs that he had heard Picasso wanted to make an animation film.  Jacobs went to see Picasso, when he was in France, but was turned away at the gate.  'He blamed me for it,' says Peters.  'He was a total neurotic.'  Most of Peters' ideas for 'Planet of the Apes' never made it before the cameras.  And the Statue of Liberty ending?  'It was my idea,' he says.  'At least three of the paintings I did were of the Statue of Liberty.'  And no one asked him to do it?  Serling?  Edwards?  Jacobs?  'It was my idea. . . I never asked for credits.'"

So, what does everyone think of that story?  I don't know.  It may be true.  Why would this eighty-year-old guy, contacted out of the blue, lie?

Anyway, as I've said, this book is a must-have for a serious APES' fan.  I wish I had a scanner.  One of Peters' paintings of the Statue of Liberty ending is reproduced in it.  Maybe Alan Maxwell can do that for us? (hint, hint)

-- Rory  

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 6:35 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing

In a message dated 10/11/01 8:52:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, LordTZer0@... writes:

<<  Now, BENEATH I would say takes place over the course of only a few days,
BUT how long was the period supposed to be between PLANET and BENEATH? >>


I'm guessing at least a year, maybe more.

Well, I don't think that's possible.  I'd say only two weeks at most.  Why?  How long do you think it took Taylor and Nova to ride from the Statue of Liberty to the area near New York City where Taylor gets captured?  A couple days I would think, maybe not even that!  Now, how long is Nova supposed to be roaming the desert on that horse with no name?  (I'll bet it felt good for her to get out of the rain.)  Probably only another fews days before she stumbles across Brent and his crashed ship.  Then it probably only took another couple days for them to ride to Ape City.

Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at the end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy?  And there were only engaged in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH.  And in the same amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the mutants in the Forbidden Zone.

This is yet another reason why BENEATH is a mess, and is best thought of as "based" on the first film.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html <.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 6:35 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing

In a message dated 10/11/01 8:52:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, LordTZer0@... writes:

<<  Now, BENEATH I would say takes place over the course of only a few days,
BUT how long was the period supposed to be between PLANET and BENEATH? >>


I'm guessing at least a year, maybe more.

Well, I don't think that's possible.  I'd say only two weeks at most.  Why?  How long do you think it took Taylor and Nova to ride from the Statue of Liberty to the area near New York City where Taylor gets captured?  A couple days I would think, maybe not even that!  Now, how long is Nova supposed to be roaming the desert on that horse with no name?  (I'll bet it felt good for her to get out of the rain.)  Probably only another fews days before she stumbles across Brent and his crashed ship.  Then it probably only took another couple days for them to ride to Ape City.

Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at the end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy?  And there were only engaged in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH.  And in the same amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the mutants in the Forbidden Zone.

This is yet another reason why BENEATH is a mess, and is best thought of as "based" on the first film.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Ken & Heather Taylor

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2001 8:58 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing

 

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to fly???
Here we go again..........
 

-KEN

I'm not arguing as to the whys of the thing, just that it's an awful lot to have happened in what must have been a VERY short period of time between PLANET and BENEATH, because just how long could Nova have been out there alone in the Forbidden Zone?

As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html
As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory

Well, I did check the Marvel adaption of Beneath. The lines were also in there, so its pretty safe to say that they were in the original shooting script. My guess is they were shot, but then cut. (Just like the complete Ursus speech, and the complete steambath scene.)<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/11/01 11:51:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to fly???
Here we go again..........
 -KEN

Oh yeah, I forgot that!   Best not to think about these things, I think.  Just watch the movies as if we were children again.

-- Rory<.html

.html Yeah, In the scheme of things..does it really matter or distract from our enjoyment from when we first saw them? Not in my case.
Best,
KEN

Haristas@... wrote:

In a message dated 10/11/01 11:51:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:
 
 

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to fly???
Here we go again..........
 -KEN

Oh yeah, I forgot that!   Best not to think about these things, I think.  Just watch the movies as if we were children again.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 12:22:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, veetus@... writes:

One could nitpick about the first film too, sir!

That's true, sir, but why does one want to bother doing that?  PLANET is the classic of the bunch and therefore deserves the respect and silence of those WHO WOULD TEAR IT DOWN!!!   We original APES fans have learned to live in innocence.  Let no Johnny-come-lately APES fan like Krueger DARE to contaminate that innocence!

NO SOUP FOR YOU, KRUEGER!

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 12:22:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time, whitty@... writes:

Off on vacation for 2 days - I''l talk to you guys when I get back.

Be nice to Alex!

Michael




Who?<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 12:29:59 AM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory

Well, I did check the Marvel adaption of Beneath. The lines were also in there, so its pretty safe to say that they were in the original shooting script. My guess is they were shot, but then cut. (Just like the complete Ursus speech, and the complete steambath scene.)


Well, I got my BENEATH script out.  It's titled "Planet of the Apes Revisited" and it's dated December 20th, 1968.
In this version Dr. Zaius never even visits Cornelius and Zira's house!  Instead we have this exchange:

                           Zira
         Then if ever yousee Taylor again, tell him to stay clear of the Forbidden Zone.  General Ursus believes that it's inhabited.  He intends to invade.  Even out Minister of Science dare not stop him.

                           Brent
          Dare not?

                           Cornelius
                 (earnestly)
          Dr. Zaius, alone among our leaders knows that Man evolved from the Apes and, at one time, became their superior.  He knows how Man abused that superiority and nearly destroyed the world.  He knows that evolution can strike twice; and that even when every Human alive today has been slaughtered, Man could still re-evolve from the very Apes who once made him extinct.  And then. . . .

                            ZIRA
           . . . Zaius fears that the whole destructive cycle could begin again.  But he has to bear the burden of that fear -- without sharing it.  Because if he shared it and proclaimed the truth, the Apes (who believe they are God's chosen) would lose their thousand-year-old faith in God's choice.  Zaius hopes for peace through the preservation of innocence.

                          BRENT
             And you?

ZIRA smiles at CORNELIUS, who smiles back.

                          CORNELIUS
             Through the propagation of knowledge.


A pretty neat exchange, eh?  I guess then they thought it would be better to have Zaius drop in, and that dialogue got dropped.  Does anyone in the group have a BENEATH script with a later date, like APRIL 1969?

-- Rory<.html

.html Exactly.

Haristas@... wrote:

 

Who?

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 3:35 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing

In a message dated 10/12/01 12:29:59 AM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

As to the lines cut from BENEATH. . . . I would guess they were cut before the scene was shot, but who knows?  I have a shooting script from BENEATH.  I'll have to get it out this weekend and check that scene, to make sure those lines aren't just from the novelization.

-- Rory

Well, I did check the Marvel adaption of Beneath. The lines were also in there, so its pretty safe to say that they were in the original shooting script. My guess is they were shot, but then cut. (Just like the complete Ursus speech, and the complete steambath scene.)

Well, I got my BENEATH script out.  It's titled "Planet of the Apes Revisited" and it's dated December 20th, 1968.
In this version Dr. Zaius never even visits Cornelius and Zira's house!  Instead we have this exchange:

                           Zira
         Then if ever yousee Taylor again, tell him to stay clear of the Forbidden Zone.  General Ursus believes that it's inhabited.  He intends to invade.  Even out Minister of Science dare not stop him.

                           Brent
          Dare not?

                           Cornelius
                 (earnestly)
          Dr. Zaius, alone among our leaders knows that Man evolved from the Apes and, at one time, became their superior.  He knows how Man abused that superiority and nearly destroyed the world.  He knows that evolution can strike twice; and that even when every Human alive today has been slaughtered, Man could still re-evolve from the very Apes who once made him extinct.  And then. . . .

                            ZIRA
           . . . Zaius fears that the whole destructive cycle could begin again.  But he has to bear the burden of that fear -- without sharing it.  Because if he shared it and proclaimed the truth, the Apes (who believe they are God's chosen) would lose their thousand-year-old faith in God's choice.  Zaius hopes for peace through the preservation of innocence.

                          BRENT
             And you?

ZIRA smiles at CORNELIUS, who smiles back.

                          CORNELIUS
             Through the propagation of knowledge.


A pretty neat exchange, eh?  I guess then they thought it would be better to have Zaius drop in, and that dialogue got dropped.  Does anyone in the group have a BENEATH script with a later date, like APRIL 1969?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

<MTotsky@...> wrote:

> Here's my theory on how they retrieved the ship: it never sank to begin

with.

Maybe it sank briefly in a very shallow patch of water, then when the water
level dropped it resurfaced, before it had become completely waterlogged.

Yeah, I know, I'm really stretching.

Alan

Rory <Haristas@...> wrote:

> Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at

the

> end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy? And there were only

engaged

> in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH. And in the same
> amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the

mutants

> in the Forbidden Zone.

It's feasible that these events took place pretty quickly, although
unlikely. But in the end, it's probably more correct to say that it simply
doesn't fit. What the hell, it's still great!

While we're on the subject, does anyone know if Zira's throwaway line about
their child in Beneath was perhaps deliberately planting a seed for a
sequel? Or was it just coincidence?

Alan

<mlccougar@...> wrote:

> Well, I did check the Marvel adaption of Beneath. The lines were also in
> there, so its pretty safe to say that they were in the original shooting
> script. My guess is they were shot, but then cut. (Just like the complete
> Ursus speech, and the complete steambath scene.)

Maybe it says more about my filthy mind, but did anyone else have a truly
grotesque image of Zaius and Ursus in their head at the mention of the
phrase "the complete steambath scene"?

Sorry.

Alan

Attachments :

Rory <Haristas@...> wrote:

> Anyway, as I've said, this book is a must-have for a serious APES' fan. I
> wish I had a scanner. One of Peters' paintings of the Statue of Liberty
> ending is reproduced in it. Maybe Alan Maxwell can do that for us? (hint,
> hint)

I don't have the book to hand at the moment, but is this the picture you
meant? (Apologies for the quality)

I'd like to back Rory up anyway - I have only read snippets of the book, but
it looks like a must-buy.

Alan

Rory <Haristas@...> wrote:

> Are you talking about the original PLANET, Alan? If so, yes, I would

agree

> that the events in the film took place over the course of at least a month

or

> more. Remember when Taylor sees Zira at the trial he says to her, "Where
> have you been, it's been weeks." (or something to that affect.)

I forgot all about that! I've never really thought about that line. It's
just gone in one ear and out the other - so what the hell DID they do for
those few weeks?

Alan

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 3:02:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alan@... writes:

I forgot all about that! I've never really thought about that line. It's
just gone in one ear and out the other - so what the hell DID they do for
those few weeks?

Alan

Well. . . . Taylor and Nova were in that cage together. . . . What would you do nearly naked in a cage with Nova?

Aaaaah, it's GOOD to be on the Planet of the Apes!

-- Rory


.<.html

During those few weeks, Zira got pregnant, dear boy!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Maxwell" <alan@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 10:49 AM
Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing


> Rory <Haristas@...> wrote:
> > Are you talking about the original PLANET, Alan? If so, yes, I would
> agree
> > that the events in the film took place over the course of at least a
month
> or
> > more. Remember when Taylor sees Zira at the trial he says to her,
"Where
> > have you been, it's been weeks." (or something to that affect.)
>
> I forgot all about that! I've never really thought about that line. It's
> just gone in one ear and out the other - so what the hell DID they do for
> those few weeks?
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Are you thinking along the lines of the Tony Curtis bath scene in
"Sparticus"?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Maxwell" <alan@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 10:59 AM
Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing


> <mlccougar@...> wrote:
> > Well, I did check the Marvel adaption of Beneath. The lines were also in
> > there, so its pretty safe to say that they were in the original shooting
> > script. My guess is they were shot, but then cut. (Just like the
complete
> > Ursus speech, and the complete steambath scene.)
>
> Maybe it says more about my filthy mind, but did anyone else have a truly
> grotesque image of Zaius and Ursus in their head at the mention of the
> phrase "the complete steambath scene"?
>
> Sorry.
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 2:53:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alan@... writes:

I don't have the book to hand at the moment, but is this the picture you
meant? (Apologies for the quality)

Yeah, that's the picture.  Thanks, Alan.

-- Rory<.html

If they decided to blow up the world I doubt they were sowing the seeds
for a sequel in any way, shape or form.

-
- - Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Maxwell" <alan@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 10:56 AM
Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing


> Rory <Haristas@...> wrote:
> > Of course none of this makes sense because weren't Cornelius and Zira at
> the
> > end of PLANET supposed to be tried for heresy? And there were only
> engaged
> > in PLANET, but married and living together in BENEATH. And in the same
> > amount of time eleven gorilla scouts get themselves captured by the
> mutants
> > in the Forbidden Zone.
>
> It's feasible that these events took place pretty quickly, although
> unlikely. But in the end, it's probably more correct to say that it simply
> doesn't fit. What the hell, it's still great!
>
> While we're on the subject, does anyone know if Zira's throwaway line
about
> their child in Beneath was perhaps deliberately planting a seed for a
> sequel? Or was it just coincidence?
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

In a message dated 10/12/01 1:53:51 PM Central Daylight Time,
alan@... writes:

<< I'd like to back Rory up anyway - I have only read snippets of the book,
but
it looks like a must-buy. >>

They're back ordered.
A 3 to 5 week wait.

<< I forgot all about that! I've never really thought about that line. It's
just gone in one ear and out the other - so what the hell DID they do for
those few weeks? >>

How do you think Nova got pregnant?
I doubt they were playing cards.

.html I think it was coincidence as they didn't greenlight the sequels until the previous movie was released theatrically.But it may have planted the seed for the idea for Escape.
Best,
KEN
 

 

While we're on the subject, does anyone know if Zira's throwaway line about
their child in Beneath was perhaps deliberately planting a seed for a
sequel? Or was it just coincidence?

Alan
 
 
 

<.html

What, like Zaius was Ursus' sugar daddy?
Yes, that's just your filthy mind...sicko
:~)

>
>
> Maybe it says more about my filthy mind, but did anyone else have a truly
> grotesque image of Zaius and Ursus in their head at the mention of the
> phrase "the complete steambath scene"?
>
> Sorry.
>
> Alan
>

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 2:44:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alan@... writes:

While we're on the subject, does anyone know if Zira's throwaway line about
their child in Beneath was perhaps deliberately planting a seed for a
sequel? Or was it just coincidence?

Alan

Coincidence.  They had no plans for another film when they made BENEATH.  I guess that's why they blew-up the world at the end, eh?

-- Rory<.html

<< Yeah, In the scheme of things..does it really matter or distract from
our enjoyment from when we first saw them? Not in my case >>


They asked the director why he was spending so much time on the desert
footage and he said because it sets the tone for the rest of the film. And
it does that. At times I feel it's a little to long, both in the beginning
and at the end. One thing you can say about it though -- It certainly
doesn't feel rushed.

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 7:51:38 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@... writes:

They had no plans for another film when they made BENEATH.  I guess that's why they blew-up the world at the end, eh?

If all he says is true, we have Heston to thank for that bright idea...I would have liked to see at least one more film actually "on" the Planet of the Apes, rather than our Earth, or Earth leading up to the Planet.....<.html

And of course "2001" was released a month later and that didn't feel
rushed either. That era was Jerry Bruckheimer's worst
- - - Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: <LordTZer0@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 12:41 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing


>
> << Yeah, In the scheme of things..does it really matter or distract from
> our enjoyment from when we first saw them? Not in my case >>
>
>
> They asked the director why he was spending so much time on the desert
> footage and he said because it sets the tone for the rest of the film.
And
> it does that. At times I feel it's a little to long, both in the
beginning
> and at the end. One thing you can say about it though -- It certainly
> doesn't feel rushed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I can wait. Right now I have more POTA books than I can read. How do the
"Star Trek" and "Star Wars" fans do it?


- - - Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: <LordTZer0@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] The Legend of the Planet of the Apes


> In a message dated 10/12/01 1:53:51 PM Central Daylight Time,
> alan@... writes:
>
> << I'd like to back Rory up anyway - I have only read snippets of the
book,
> but
> it looks like a must-buy. >>
>
> They're back ordered.
> A 3 to 5 week wait.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 3:24 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] film pacing

In a message dated 10/12/01 3:02:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alan@... writes:

I forgot all about that! I've never really thought about that line. It's
just gone in one ear and out the other - so what the hell DID they do for
those few weeks?

Alan

Well. . . . Taylor and Nova were in that cage together. . . . What would you do nearly naked in a cage with Nova?

Aaaaah, it's GOOD to be on the Planet of the Apes!

-- Rory


.

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

In a message dated 10/12/01 9:05:40 PM, LordTZer0@... writes:

<< They asked the director why he was spending so much time on the desert
footage and he said because it sets the tone for the rest of the film. And
it does that. At times I feel it's a little to long, both in the beginning
and at the end. One thing you can say about it though -- It certainly
doesn't feel rushed. >>

You know, that whole sequence of Taylor, Landon and Dodge tracking across the
desert is one of my favorite parts of the film. It really does make be feel
anticipation every time I see it. POTA 2001 could have benefited from some
similiar method of story telling.

Matt

.htmlIn a message dated 10/12/01 10:47:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:

You know, that whole sequence of Taylor, Landon and Dodge tracking across the
desert is one of my favorite parts of the film. It really does make be feel
anticipation every time I see it. POTA 2001 could have benefited from some
similiar method of story telling.

Matt

POTA 2001 could have benefited from a story PERIOD!

You know who.<.html

I can't stand the way Zanuck lies about Apes all the time.
He says in some interview about how Arthur brought him Apes and he read it
and was very moved, or something. Yeah, he was moved to say don't bring me
this Apes thing again! What a two faced Git! No wonder (comma or no comma)
he's a Hollywood exec!

<< Yeah, but Nova didn't get pregnant so he was obviously too busy
strategizing. That's the prudent thing to do. >>

Yes she did, they just cut that scene to remove that dynamic from the story.

Regis Philban was invited to the premiere, but not Arthur's family or as
far as I know, Mort Abrahams. Yet Zanuck calls Arthur his "good friend" and
Natalie let Linda Harrison stay with her when she was in town in '98. Almost
makes me relish the bad reviews, if I didn't care about the well being of
"Apes". Ooops! Don't get me started, T.

- -
- Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: <LordTZer0@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 10:27 PM
Subject: [pota] You what?


>
> I can't stand the way Zanuck lies about Apes all the time.
> He says in some interview about how Arthur brought him Apes and he read it
> and was very moved, or something. Yeah, he was moved to say don't bring
me
> this Apes thing again! What a two faced Git! No wonder (comma or no
comma)
> he's a Hollywood exec!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 1:28:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time, LordTZer0@... writes:

I can't stand the way Zanuck lies about Apes all the time.
He says in some interview about how Arthur brought him Apes and he read it
and was very moved, or something.  Yeah, he was moved to say don't bring me
this Apes thing again!  What a two faced Git!  No wonder (comma or no comma)
he's a Hollywood exec!

Bullshit is king in Hollywood.   You never say anything that wouldn't look good on Entertainment Tonight.   It's always been that way.  It's such a small community that you never know who you might be working with again, or who can damage your career.<.html

<< Almost makes me relish the bad reviews, if I didn't care about the well
being of
"Apes". Ooops! Don't get me started, T. >>

Hey, I'm just getting started. Either this guy is completely dense or people
just deliberately leave him out of the loop! When asked about interspecies
sex in the film after Wahlberg started that rumor, he said there wasn't
anything like that, that 'it was about like the first film, oh sure, they
like each other, but they don't even kiss.'
The fact that 'The Kiss' was left out of this script suggest to me that
Zanuck was against that aspect of the original and didn't want it in this
one. And after pissing Burton off by rushing him, Burton turned around and
put it in anyway at the last minute so they couldn't do anything about it.

<< Bullshit is king in Hollywood. You never say anything that wouldn't look
good on Entertainment Tonight. It's always been that way. It's such a
small community that you never know who you might be working with again, or
who can damage your career. >>

Trite but true, honesty is wasted on the politicians.

"Oh by the way, I was being sarcastic.
Well, Duh!"
~~~The Simpsons~~~

Hi, ya'll,

Quick question -- are the POTA View Master reels an original story, or just
adaptations of an episode/move? Thanks!

Rich

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 1:59:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rhandley@... writes:

Quick question -- are the POTA View Master reels an original story, or just
adaptations of an episode/move?  Thanks!

Rich

As I recall just an adaptation of the TV show.  Which episode, I can't recall.  I have the reels, but don't have a View Master to look at it anymore.

-- Rory<.html

Hey, there was more story in the animated episodes (and the TV series)
than there was in POTA 2001. There were even multi-episode story arcs,
which was highly unusual for a Saturday morning cartoon series back in
the 70's. Definitely worth picking up in my opinion.

Chris L.


On Thu, 11 Oct 2001 20:44:48 EDT LordTZer0@... writes:

> Someday I'm going to get those POTA toons from Terry.
> Even though I ca't remember them being all that great.

____

I'll have to look in my collection and see if I have the POTA set (don't
think I do though), but as I recall it was one of the TV episodes. I
think the same story was released both in regular format as well as the
Talking View Master.

Chris L.


On Sat, 13 Oct 2001 13:56:33 -0400 Rich Handley <rhandley@...>
writes:

> Hi, ya'll,
>
> Quick question -- are the POTA View Master reels an original story,
> or just adaptations of an episode/move? Thanks!
>
> Rich

____

.html

Are you talking about the original PLANET, Alan?  If so, yes, I would agree that the events in the film took place over the course of at least a month or more.  Remember when Taylor sees Zira at the trial he says to her, "Where have you been, it's been weeks."  (or something to that affect.)

Now, BENEATH I would say takes place over the course of only a few days, BUT how long was the period supposed to be between PLANET and BENEATH?

-- Rory

 

 

In a message dated 10/11/01 5:30:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alan@... writes:

I'm curious, what makes you say this? I could perhaps have missed something
in the film, but I've always thought that it took place within a matter of
days, certainly no more than a couple of weeks. I'd be interested to hear
folks' theories, now that we've hopefully all stopped fighting each other.

Alan

 

 

"Chris Lawless" <lawford42@...>
> This is something I wanted to comment on but never got around to. The
> story of the new film seems so rushed, so forced, so over before it even
> starts. And the strange thing is, the original has a slightly shorter
> running time, but that story takes place over the course of a couple of
> months (at least).

 

<.html

.html I believe that the view master reels are based on the pilot episode.
Also, I know a collector who had salesman samples of the viewmaster reels for "Beneath" which were never released for some reason. Interestingly, there were four reels instead of the regular three. A pretty rare piece for both APES and Viewmaster collectors alike.
Best,
KEN

Haristas@... wrote:

In a message dated 10/13/01 1:59:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rhandley@... writes:
 
 

Quick question -- are the POTA View Master reels an original story, or just
adaptations of an episode/move?  Thanks!

Rich
 
 
 

As I recall just an adaptation of the TV show.  Which episode, I can't recall.  I have the reels, but don't have a View Master to look at it anymore.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 5:14:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lawford42@... writes:

Hey, there was more story in the animated episodes (and the TV series)
than there was in POTA 2001. There were even multi-episode story arcs,
which was highly unusual for a Saturday morning cartoon series back in
the 70's. Definitely worth picking up in my opinion.

Chris L.

The only problem with it was the limited animation, AND when the stories started involving flying serpents and snow apes.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 5:38:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:

I believe that the view master reels are based on the pilot episode.
Also, I know a collector who had salesman samples of the viewmaster reels for "Beneath" which were never released for some reason. Interestingly, there were four reels instead of the regular three. A pretty rare piece for both APES and Viewmaster collectors alike.
Best,
KEN

Yeah, Joe Russo keeps going on as to how he'd love to get those View Master reels from BENEATH.  He, too, doesn't know why they were never released.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlThe first episode Escape from Tomorrow is on the reels.I have them.Bryan<.html

.htmlHi Michael,Just recieved your money today safe and sound! Now we just have to get them Nov 20th I will send them out the same week.Take care Bryan<.html

.html <.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 12:59:57 PM Central Daylight Time, rhandley@... writes:

Hi, ya'll,

Quick question -- are the POTA View Master reels an original story, or just
adaptations of an episode/move?  Thanks!

Rich

They are the first episode of the television series (Escape From Tomorrow.) They were done two ways, as regular View Master reels, and as Talking View Masters...<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 4:38:24 PM Central Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:

Also, I know a collector who had salesman samples of the viewmaster reels for "Beneath" which were never released for some reason. Interestingly, there were four reels instead of the regular three. A pretty rare piece for both APES and Viewmaster collectors alike.

I have also heard of the Beneath reels. From what I have heard, they were not released due to their being too violent...Pretty stupid really, the kids could see the violence on the big screen (or on tv), but not in their View Master "cameras."<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 6:00:01 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@... writes:

The only problem with it was the limited animation, AND when the stories started involving flying serpents and snow apes.

That's my problem with the Return series too...It, along with the crap in the Marvel Magazines original stories, was the first big time cheapening / mockery of the Apes name...(To be continued later on in the early 90s with the Adventure / Malibu Graphics...and now, in this year with...Oh never mind, I won't start that up again.)

While I would have rather had the Return series Apes be low tech as in the first 2 films, and the tv show, their having the tech as in the novel was ok, but it
was done too stupidly. They should have just been "horse and buggy." To me, that tech fits better with the Apes world of the future, and the whole Apes hating humans because they destroyed the world with their high tech. But they chose a different setting.

And I don't think the stories themselves are all bad, but even then, the good ones are ruined. Look at "Lagoon of Peril', a great story, but then they screwed it up by adding the sea serpent. Why they had to do stuff like that, I'll never know.

<.html

.html Keep checking those bargain bins and outlet malls.
Best,
KEN

mystic4ever wrote:

In my corner of the world (Southern Ontario, Canada), I have yet to see the 12" Thade figure.  Has it been released to stores anywhere in the U.S. yet?  I found the 12" Daena this week, very cheap.  The first wave of regular size figures is down to $2 a pop at WalMart and I've only found the second wave of figures (Ape Commander, Pericles, etc.) at comic book shops.  Does anyone know what the plans are for Ape merchandise during the next few months as Christmas approaches? Thanks. Dan  

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 7:03:36 PM Central Daylight Time, Kay53531@... writes:

Hi Michael,Just recieved your money today safe and sound! Now we just have to get them Nov 20th I will send them out the same week.Take care Bryan

I remember covering this the last time I was in the group. While it's not anything bad, I just don't see why you don't contact these people privately (rather than in the group.) I mean the email addresses of those you are dealing with are on the emails they send to the group, so you can just contact them privately about your dealings with them.

<.html

.html I'd say because it was a cartoon series aimed at kids and they probably felt the series needed some diversity. Even though the animation was limited, look at the quality of animation of some of today's most popular kids cartoons like 'Dragonball Z' and 'Pokemon'. I don't think the animation was the problem. TV animation during the 70's was generally crappy.
What they really needed was some Wonder Twins and a cute animal sidekick.
;-}

mlccougar@... wrote:
And I don't think the stories themselves are all bad, but even then, the good ones are ruined. Look at "Lagoon of Peril', a great story, but then they screwed it up by adding the sea serpent. Why they had to do stuff like that, I'll never know.

 
 

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Ken & Heather Taylor

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 7:14 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Merchandise

Keep checking those bargain bins and outlet malls.
Best,
KEN

mystic4ever wrote:

In my corner of the world (Southern Ontario, Canada), I have yet to see the 12" Thade figure.  Has it been released to stores anywhere in the U.S. yet?  I found the 12" Daena this week, very cheap.  The first wave of regular size figures is down to $2 a pop at WalMart and I've only found the second wave of figures (Ape Commander, Pericles, etc.) at comic book shops.  Does anyone know what the plans are for Ape merchandise during the next few months as Christmas approaches? Thanks. Dan  

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

<.html

In a message dated 10/13/01 4:49:23 PM, Haristas@... writes:

<< As I recall just an adaptation of the TV show. Which episode, I can't
recall. I have the reels, but don't have a View Master to look at it
anymore. >>

Man I used to have alot of View Masters when I was a kid, but they are long
gone. Now that my son has one, I wish I had some of the old ones to check out
again.

Ah, memories.....

Matt

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

Matt

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the
time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's
ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to
fly???

Well, I always kinda thought that Cornelius and Zira mentioned the
sunken ship to Milo, and they really didn't have anything to do with
its recovery. I mean while they were dealing with the whole Taylor
situation, Milo (and possibly other scientists / archeologists) could
have been in the Forbidden Zone dealing with the ship. And as was
mentioned many times before (in other's theories on this,) he could
have found flight instruction manuals aboard the ship. And while his
knowledge was still very limited as to the ships actual operation, he
may have been able to figure out how to use the auto pilot function.
And after figuring that out, he may have said to Zira and
Cornelius, "Well, the human's story was true. There really was a
sunken ship in the inland sea. He wasn't lying to you...I think I
have learned the basics to flying this machine." And wanting to
escape the Ape / Mutant conflict, they board the ship, (maybe just
wanting to travel to a "safer" area of the country.) But as theorized
before, the thrust from the explosion throws the ship into orbit and
eventually, back to present day Earth.

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 9:40:44 PM Central Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

While I can see why you did it, I would have to say that, yes, it's wrong.<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 9:24:24 PM Central Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:

What they really needed was some Wonder Twins and a cute animal sidekick.

Twin Apes and a human huh??<.html

.html And an overweight geanie who said "yabble dabble". And the next year they could have introduced this phantom that was kind of funky, he could have been the Spirit of '76..3976 that is.
I'll stop now.
Best,
KEN

mlccougar@... wrote:

In a message dated 10/13/01 9:24:24 PM Central Daylight Time, kentaylor@... writes:
 
 

What they really needed was some Wonder Twins and a cute animal sidekick.

Twin Apes and a human huh??

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html Some ( looking your way Rory) would argue that making the new movie was wrong.
After all, movie merchandise is created TO make a profit from. Matt was just creatively redistributing the profit.
Who am I kidding? Matt, go to confession and say 16 'Hail Lawgivers'.

mlccougar@... wrote:

In a message dated 10/13/01 9:40:44 PM Central Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:
 
 

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

While I can see why you did it, I would have to say that, yes, it's wrong.

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html <.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 8:03:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Kay53531@... writes:

Hi Michael,Just recieved your money today safe and sound! Now we just have to get them Nov 20th I will send them out the same week.Take care Bryan

Is this a message to Michael Whitty?  Are you sending him the DVDs of the TV show when it comes out?   I checked with Fox and they said no one in Australia is allowed to get them from the States.  The Aussies have to wait until the offical Fox Aussie release of the show on DVD.  So, you better not send him anything because I told Fox where you live and you're gonna be in BIG trouble, buddy!   You think Alex left because we were mean to him?  No!  I narced on him to Fox for being the shameless bootlegger that he was!  The Feds now got him locked up in Miami.

-- Rory (Fox narc!)<.html

.htmlNo address was Givin, Mikes email would not go through thats why I used the group to send him my message! So Relax no harm done.Bryan<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 10:05:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

While I would have rather had the Return series Apes be low tech as in the first 2 films, and the tv show, their having the tech as in the novel was ok, but it
was done too stupidly. They should have just been "horse and buggy." To me, that tech fits better with the Apes world of the future, and the whole Apes hating humans because they destroyed the world with their high tech.

I think what's cool about the Apes in the Boulle novel living in an early 60's technology world is that they simply took it over from the humans and just 'aped' how they lived.  Being apes, they could only 'ape' -- they weren't inventors.  In the book, the Apes had been 'aping' it for 10,000 years!!!   Imagine it, nothing had changed in all that time, not the cars, planes, buildings, clothes.  When Merou arrives, the ape society was just beginning to come out of this dark age and starting to become originators.  When you think about some of Boulle's ideas in the book, you can see how really creepy the book is.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 10:35:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:

<< As I recall just an adaptation of the TV show.  Which episode, I can't
recall.  I have the reels, but don't have a View Master to look at it
anymore. >>

Man I used to have alot of View Masters when I was a kid, but they are long
gone. Now that my son has one, I wish I had some of the old ones to check out
again.

Ah, memories.....

Matt

"alot"!!!!!!     "ALOT"!!!!!!     You teaching your son that?!!!!<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 10:40:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

Matt

I'm telling Fox AND Hasbro on you!!!!!     You're a BAD boy!<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 10:50:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the
time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's
ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to
fly???

Well, I always kinda thought that Cornelius and Zira mentioned the
sunken ship to Milo, and they really didn't have anything to do with
its recovery. I mean while they were dealing with the whole Taylor
situation, Milo (and possibly other scientists / archeologists) could
have been in the Forbidden Zone dealing with the ship. And as was
mentioned many times before (in other's theories on this,) he could
have found flight instruction manuals aboard the ship. And while his
knowledge was still very limited as to the ships actual operation, he
may have been able to figure out how to use the auto pilot function.
And after figuring that out, he may have said to Zira and
Cornelius, "Well, the human's story was true. There really was a
sunken ship in the inland sea. He wasn't lying to you...I think I
have learned the basics to flying this machine." And wanting to
escape the Ape / Mutant conflict, they board the ship, (maybe just
wanting to travel to a "safer" area of the country.) But as theorized
before, the thrust from the explosion throws the ship into orbit and
eventually, back to present day Earth.

No, Matt.  Actually it was just the mutants creating an illusion and Dr. Milo only thought he found the ship and repaired it.  Later, all three of the chimps again only 'thought' they took off in the ship and went back in time.  ESCAPE was only an illusion and CONQUEST and BATTLE never really happened.  In fact you only think you're reading this e-mail.  In reality it's mere illusion.

Well, this makes about as much sense as anything else.  Actually this e-mail is based on an idea created from characters created by Pierre Boulle for a strip of the comic "Veetus" created by Jeff Krueger who was having an acid trip at the time.

It's all in the mind, you know.

-- me<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/14/01 12:06:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Kay53531@... writes:

No address was Givin, Mikes email would not go through thats why I used the group to send him my message! So Relax no harm done.Bryan

Yeah, well you wait until Fox gets hold of you.  You're in trouble, buddy.   Plotting to illegally export DVDs!   You're going to get it!!!  You better start running!<.html

Thanks to all four or five of you who supplied an answer to my query about
the View Masters. :) I saw them up on eBay and was wondering whether or
not I should bid on them.

On another note, I finally got around to reading "The Human War" today from
Dark Horse. It was... well... average. Very little happened in it, and
the title doesn't seem all that vitally descriptive. I **much** preferred
the stories from Marvel and Malibu. I also thought the Dark Horse Extra
three-parter and the mini-comic were equally boring. Dark Horse is
starting off on a bad foot with POTA, in my opinion -- I hope the ongoing
series is better.

.htmlHey Ape Heads,

I just got through watching the DVD of John Landis' 1971 movie "Schlock."  I'd forgotten how bad this movie is, but fun at times to watch.   Among the many things in it that a film buff can get a kick out of is a gorilla background mask from PLANET and BENEATH that someone in the movie puts on because they're shot.  Oh yeah, John Chambers comes in at the end.

What I enjoyed best was the commentary track by Landis and Rick Baker.  It was 'alot' of fun to listen to, but some of the stories Landis tells really makes you see how his 'character' would lead to the 'Twilight Zone' incident, which of course never gets mentioned by Landis or Baker.

Anyway, I recommend getting this disc, or renting it, although you'll get called a 'fucker' by Landis at the end of the commentary if you just rent it.  I'm sending my copy to Matt this week because he's never heard of this movie, and Matt's a sweetie.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/14/01 12:25:56 AM Eastern Daylight Time, rhandley@... writes:

On another note, I finally got around to reading "The Human War" today from
Dark Horse.  It was... well... average.  Very little happened in it, and
the title doesn't seem all that vitally descriptive.  I **much** preferred
the stories from Marvel and Malibu.  I also thought the Dark Horse Extra
three-parter and the mini-comic were equally boring.  Dark Horse is
starting off on a bad foot with POTA, in my opinion -- I hope the ongoing
series is better.

This sounds like a review to Burton's movie!  "Average"  "Boring" "Very little happened in it"    Yeah, that's a review of the new movie!

-- Rory<.html

.html <.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 9:09 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Merchandise

In a message dated 10/13/01 10:40:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, MTotsky@... writes:

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

Matt

I'm telling Fox AND Hasbro on you!!!!!     You're a BAD boy!

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 9:15 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: film pacing

In a message dated 10/13/01 10:50:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mlccougar@... writes:

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the
time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's
ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to
fly???

Well, I always kinda thought that Cornelius and Zira mentioned the
sunken ship to Milo, and they really didn't have anything to do with
its recovery. I mean while they were dealing with the whole Taylor
situation, Milo (and possibly other scientists / archeologists) could
have been in the Forbidden Zone dealing with the ship. And as was
mentioned many times before (in other's theories on this,) he could
have found flight instruction manuals aboard the ship. And while his
knowledge was still very limited as to the ships actual operation, he
may have been able to figure out how to use the auto pilot function.
And after figuring that out, he may have said to Zira and
Cornelius, "Well, the human's story was true. There really was a
sunken ship in the inland sea. He wasn't lying to you...I think I
have learned the basics to flying this machine." And wanting to
escape the Ape / Mutant conflict, they board the ship, (maybe just
wanting to travel to a "safer" area of the country.) But as theorized
before, the thrust from the explosion throws the ship into orbit and
eventually, back to present day Earth.

No, Matt.  Actually it was just the mutants creating an illusion and Dr. Milo only thought he found the ship and repaired it.  Later, all three of the chimps again only 'thought' they took off in the ship and went back in time.  ESCAPE was only an illusion and CONQUEST and BATTLE never really happened.  In fact you only think you're reading this e-mail.  In reality it's mere illusion.

Well, this makes about as much sense as anything else.  Actually this e-mail is based on an idea created from characters created by Pierre Boulle for a strip of the comic "Veetus" created by Jeff Krueger who was having an acid trip at the time.

It's all in the mind, you know.

-- me
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

I kinda like the comics. They bring back some of the feel of the originals
even though they take place in the Burtonian landscape.

- - - Apenonymous

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Handley" <rhandley@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 9:25 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] Digest Number 737


> Thanks to all four or five of you who supplied an answer to my query about
> the View Masters. :) I saw them up on eBay and was wondering whether or
> not I should bid on them.
>
> On another note, I finally got around to reading "The Human War" today
from
> Dark Horse. It was... well... average. Very little happened in it, and
> the title doesn't seem all that vitally descriptive. I **much** preferred
> the stories from Marvel and Malibu. I also thought the Dark Horse Extra
> three-parter and the mini-comic were equally boring. Dark Horse is
> starting off on a bad foot with POTA, in my opinion -- I hope the ongoing
> series is better.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Matt,

That is very original, well done.

And of course they just pressed one button for Auto Lift Off and Auto Pilot
and away the flew.

Ape-ologies in advance if someon else says the same thing but I am back from
vacation and there are another 105 emails to read.....WOW!

Michael

> -----Original Message-----
> From: MTotsky@... [MTotsky@...]

>
> Here's my theory on how they retrieved the ship: it never sank to
> begin with.
> What Taylor, Landon and Dodge saw was just an illusion cast by
> the mutants to
> confuse them even further.
>
> As far as how they learned to fly it, I have no clue.
>
> Anyone else got any?
>
> Matt
>

>
>

.html

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexander Ruiz [prophecysite@...]
Sent: Sunday, 14 October 2001 14:50
To: pota@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [pota] STAR WARS DVD

You think Alex left because we were mean to him?  No!  I narced on him to Fox for being the shameless bootlegger that he was!  The Feds now got him locked up in Miami.

Hey gang.

Just got out of prison and have a court date for Nov. 20th, but hey all is well.

Just letting "my friends" on the group know that Star Wars Episode 1 DVD really rocks. My God "SEMOS" I've spent all day watching this. TONS of DOCs and TONS of fun on this DVD. Pretty much this thing will be just like the DVD of POTA 2001 in November according to the desciption on the POTA DVD.

Man, this Star Wars DVD has every t.v. spot from Access to Entertainment Tonight on it, not the spots themselves but rather the footage used for those spots in it's complete raw footage. INCREDIBLE!

 

I also picked up the Star Wars Original Trilogy on DVD, the dealer had them imported from HONG KONG and was selling them. Oh well, off to prison I go again. But honestly, the quality is superb! And will hold me off until Lucas officially releases them in 2006 or something. Pretty much I'm in Star Wars Heaven right now.

 

Have a good weekend gang, and Rory, why don't you just admit it.

You miss me. :o)

 

Best.

Al

 

<.html

So do I - that was really poor. They seem to dedicate a frame to each
footstep the characters take. Here's hoping for some better ideas.

Michael

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rich Handley [rhandley@...]
> Sent: Sunday, 14 October 2001 14:25
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [pota] Digest Number 737
>
>
> Thanks to all four or five of you who supplied an answer to my query about
> the View Masters. :) I saw them up on eBay and was wondering whether or
> not I should bid on them.
>
> On another note, I finally got around to reading "The Human War"
> today from
> Dark Horse. It was... well... average. Very little happened in it, and
> the title doesn't seem all that vitally descriptive. I **much** preferred
> the stories from Marvel and Malibu. I also thought the Dark Horse Extra
> three-parter and the mini-comic were equally boring. Dark Horse is
> starting off on a bad foot with POTA, in my opinion -- I hope the ongoing
> series is better.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.htmlIn a message dated 10/14/01 8:56:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, veetus@... writes:

 Did they really believe you bought 9 of them at full price?

Around here (Detroit) they have the 12" Attars and the Thade w/ Horse on
clearance at Target for $5.00. I bought all of the Thades that they had (10),
kept one, and returned the rest to Toys R Us (where they haven't been marked
down yet) for $24.00 apiece in store credit. Is this wrong?

Matt

Actually, I think there's something bogus about this story.  You'd need a receipt from an original purchase to return all those figures for credit.  If not, then Toys-R-Us is stupid.

But really, I think Matt is too busy sitting at home breast feeding right now to be running around with action figures.

Are your nipples really sore, Matt?

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/14/01 9:04:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time, veetus@... writes:

 "Planet" and "Beneath" were dreamed by Cornelius while he was in the spaceship waiting to arrive in "Escape". He put Zira and Milo on drugs and convinced them of this as truth. The first 2 films never really happened. Rory watched dead air 500 times when he thought he was watching "Planet".

                                                                    - - - - Penis Head



Don't say 'penis,' rude boy!   Say 'John Thomas,' the name they were originally going to call George Taylor in the PLANET scripts.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 10/13/01 11:16:19 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@... writes:

And while we're hypothesizing, when did Zira and Cornelius get the
time to find, retrieve and have Milo figure out how to fly Taylor's
ship when most astronauts spend months, even years training to
fly???

Well, I always kinda thought that Cornelius and Zira mentioned the
sunken ship to Milo, and they really didn't have anything to do with
its recovery. I mean while they were dealing with the whole Taylor
situation, Milo (and possibly other scientists / archeologists) could
have been in the Forbidden Zone dealing with the ship. And as was
mentioned many times before (in other's theories on this,) he could
have found flight instruction manuals aboard the ship. And while his
knowledge was still very limited as to the ships actual operation, he
may have been able to figure out how to use the auto pilot function.
And after figuring that out, he may have said to Zira and
Cornelius, "Well, the human's story was true. There really was a
sunken ship in the inland sea. He wasn't lying to you...I think I
have learned the basics to flying this machine." And wanting to
escape the Ape / Mutant conflict, they board the ship, (maybe just
wanting to travel to a "safer" area of the country.) But as theorized
before, the thrust from the explosion throws the ship into orbit and
eventually, back to present day Earth.

No, Matt.  Actually it was just the mutants creating an illusion and Dr. Milo only thought he found the ship and repaired it.  Later, all three of the chimps again only 'thought' they took off in the ship and went back in time.  ESCAPE was only an illusion and CONQUEST and BATTLE never really happened.  In fact you only think you're reading this e-mail.  In reality it's mere illusion.

Well, this makes about as much sense as anything else.  Actually this e-mail is based on an idea created from characters created by Pierre Boulle for a strip of the comic "Veetus" created by Jeff Krueger who was having an acid trip at the time.

It's all in the mind, you know.

-- me

Nope, this email is based on the first paragraph at the top of the page, I just accidentally erased the originator's name before replying giving my theory. Rory, I know you're just playing around here, but it brings up something that may have been brought up in here before...but I'll say it anyway, if someone is replying to a posting, I hope they remember to include what they're replying to, or most of the time, their reply will make no sense.

And by the way Rory, I can imagine you wish Battle really was an illusion...<.html