--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** This is in reference to the orangutan seen in the book-store in
CONQUEST. ***
>
> --- On Tue, 10/28/08, rassmguy <handleyr@...> wrote:
>
> From: rassmguy <handleyr@...>
> Subject: [pota] Re: The third ship...
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2008, 7:03 PM
>
> Which orangutan is this in reference to? I must have missed that
> discussion.
>
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@> wrote:
> > *** The script may say it's a male, but c'mon James, even you have
> to acknowledge that it appears to be a female orangutan... At least
> the orangutan that T, myself, and a few others see is... The way it
> appears visually is pretty verifiable evidence, don't you think? ***
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Tue, 10/28/08, James <JamesA1102@> wrote:
> >
> > From: James <JamesA1102@>
> > Subject: [pota] Re: The third ship...
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2008, 5:03 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I think you mean arguing that a male orangutan, as stated in the
> script, is female without any verifiable evidence to back up your
> assertion.
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@ wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Or arguing that a female orangutan is male.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 10/27/2008 9:14:59 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> > > JamesA1102@ writes:
> > >
> > > It's like making an argument that a female rabbit is male.
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>

I urge everyone to go back and read Cornelius' Journal. A very logical and plasible sequence of events is laid out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/CJ.htm

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> I just don't buy it. They had food & water for 3 days.
> They could maybe stretch that for a week. So in one
> week Zira & Cornelius had their trial, or had it hushed up.
> Got married. Had their honeymoon. Got a house and
> moved in together. Okay. But if that's the case then
> they were engaged because Cornelius knocked Zira
> up. Not out of the realm of possibility, but far fetched.
>
>
>
> In a message dated 10/28/2008 5:44:20 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> Haristas@... writes:
>
> Then Nova would have been riding around on that horse all that time -- for
> months? What? Riding around in circles for months? What did she do for food
> and water? How come the gorilla scouts didn't come across her?
>
>
> No, it's about a week or a little more between PLANET and BENEATH.
>
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics â€" check it out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)
>

Well first C&Z didn't resurect the ship, Milo did. And Milo could have started his work as early as mid-way through Planet so there is plenty of time for him to accomplish everything.

Cornelius also says that Milo was a genius well in advance of his years. Plus the ship as presented in Planet was a ship that seemed to be run by computer. So it is not implausable Milo just figured out how to turn the computer on and engage the program to auto-pilot it.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "zasco1957" <Zasco1957@...> wrote:
>
> M.C., James, et al...I believe that everyone here is going to have their own
> opinion as to the "third ship", whether they think that it could be "Taylor
> s ship", "Brent's ship", or whatever. That's the whole point of this forum.
> .to discuss things, and to agree or disagree about certain things. For
> example, Mr. Tilton strongly believes in his "mothership" theory.
>
>
>
> But what I still find hard to comprehend is the fact that our chimp friends
> are very primitive--I mean, Zira and Cornelius didn't believe in flight at
> all; remember, they had trouble accepting that paper airplane that Taylor
> made...and so, how could they have possibly raised a sunken, crippled
> spacecraft from the bottom of a lake at a spot that they could only guess
> at? And take this same ship, raise it, repair all of the water damage, dump
> Stewart's body, rearrange it, install a side hatch and figure out how to
> launch it into Earth orbit in the short amount of time that they had?
>
>
>
> Besides, didn't Cornelius himself say in ESCAPE to the Presidential
> Commission that they found the ship, "intact on their seaboard"? And that
> Dr. Milo "half understood it"? Why, it takes qualified technicians years to
> fully understand the ins and outs of a working spacecraft!
>
>
>
> I'd found out about Ansanaut's site several years ago, and when I got to
> reading his sections on the "third ship theory", I arrived at the conclusion
> that his logic was correct in all points. A lot of my Apester friends won't
> agree with me here, and that's all right...again, everyone is entitled to
> their own opinions. I'll always respect them. But as for mine, I'm
> agreeing with Ansanaut, that the ship was Brent's, and it was off camera the
> whole time.
>
>
>
> Yes, I remember in ESCAPE that the president mentioned the ship that came
> back was "one of two ships that had been missing for over a year now". Well
> do you suppose that just could've simply been a mistake in the script,
> after all, the screenwriters made a major error regarding continuity (the
> 3978/3955" incident comes to mind).
>
>
>
> I'd love to hear your feedback on this.
>
>
>
> Zach
>
>
>
>
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
>
>
> From: m c
>
> Date: 10/26/08 18:35:07
>
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
>
> Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Blu-ray Disc Features
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 10/26/08, rassmguy handleyr@... wrote:
>
>
>
> From: rassmguy handleyr@...
>
> Subject: [pota] Re: Blu-ray Disc Features
>
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
>
> Date: Sunday, October 26, 2008, 1:55 PM
>
>
>
>
>
> Maybe the ship IS a zebra. That would explain everything.
>
> *** The whole "third ship" theory isn't a zebra, it's an ass...
>
> An ass who's existence isn't even defended/justified. ***
>

I'm open to it being a male or female. To me the visual evidence is inconclusive so the only available evidence to fall back on is the script which says it's a male. If someone has evidence to the contrary please present it. I'm open to the possibility of being wrong, why aren't you?

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> If you want to believe it's a male, go ahead. But it would be conjecture
> Not proof. I'm just not convinced, in spite of what any script says.
> If that's YOUR proof, then I could site a dozen scripts where the
> character was changed to this or that, or a scene was shot
> differently from what was written. POTA included. Even
> scenes that got shot were edited out. Nova's baby?
>
>
>
> In a message dated 10/29/2008 2:46:34 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> JamesA1102@... writes:
>
> If you want to believe it is a female go right ahead.
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics â€" check it out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> Takes one to know one.
>
>
>
> In a message dated 10/29/2008 2:53:17 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> JamesA1102@... writes:
>
> Maybe it was a gay Orangutan?
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics â€" check it out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> How do you KNOW exactly what's there or not there
> from a picture.

Actually I'm not but you are.

> And putting all of
> your posts in bold doesn't
> reinforce your point. It
> just looks like you're
> shouting at us.
>
Sorry if my font offends you.

It is not just the people it is the horse as well. It wouldn't last in the desert. Plus does Nova look dehydrated or suffering from malnutrition when Brent encounters her.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
> Why not? People used to fast for 40 days.
> People have been shipwrecked on rafts
> floating around the Pacific for that long,
> living off the occasional fish and rain.
>
>
>
> In a message dated 10/29/2008 2:46:46 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> JamesA1102@... writes:
>
> 6 weeks to 90 days roaming around a desert with limited food and water?
> Doesn't make any sense.
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics â€" check it out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)
>

I was going to stay out of this vote, but . . .

I suppose it could go either way. Buried,

Blasted or Both. My first impression on

first viewing in the theater as a kid?

Buried.

I guess all of you would include the pedestal too. It's all down there. Now, just where did all the earth come from to bury it? Did some aliens dredge it up from the ocean bottoms?

-- Rory

He did.

There is not much there then some shrubbery. Certainly not enough food or water to sustain them for weeks or months.

On the Blu-ray there will be better detail and then you'll notice that in the background there's the ruins of an old northern New Jersey 7/11.

Or was it a Long Island 7/11?

-- Rory

---

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See all stories on this topic

"Beneath the Planet of the Apes," the batshit crazy follow-up to the first film!

You see? Most people recognize BENEATH as crazy. The movie IS crazy!

So, it's nuts to try and make sense of it.

-- Rory

----- Original Message -----
From: Haristas@...
Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 6:20 pm
Subject: Re: [pota] Digest Number 4232

>
>
> None of that happens during Beneath--it takes
>
> place in the months between Planet and
>
> Beneath. Beneath itself spans only a few days.
> It can't be months between PLANET and BENEATH, the Statue of
> Liberty isn't that far from NYC and it seems as if Taylor would
> have had to have been near there for the mutants to have grabbed
> him. Then Nova would have been riding around on that horse all
> that time -- for months? What? Riding around in circles for
> months? What did she do for food and water? How come the gorilla
> scouts didn't come across her?
>
>
>
> No, it's about a week or a little more between PLANET and BENEATH.
>
>
>
>
> -- Rory
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

>Posted by: "James" JamesA1102@... jamesa1102
>FYI
>Google News Alert for: "planet of the apes"
>Hasslein <http://www.pr.com/press-release/113177> Books to Release Planet
>of the Apes Chronology
>PR.com (press release) - Levittown,NY,USA
>To celebrate the 40th anniversary of the Planet of the Apes film franchise,
>Hasslein Books will publish Timeline of the Planet of the Apes: The
>Definitive ...
><http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ncl=http://www.pr.com/press-release/11317
>7> See all stories on this topic

>Posted by: "Dario Sciola" darios@... lmcdasc
>Nobody can make any assertion regarding the timeframe between POTA and
>Beneath simply by saying that Nova and the horse looked none the worse
>in wear between the two scenes with her in both movies. Nova was
>nomadic by upbringing and would have known exactly where and how to
>find more food and water. The fact that when Brent urged her to go
>find Taylor she brought him right ape city proved that she was not
>lost at all and knew exactly where she was and thus also knew where to
>find food and water. She may in fact have even returned to whatever
>was left of her tribe or other scattered human groups. We know humans
>were still around and a problem for apes because Ursus was still
>ranting. Why was she roaming around the desert when she came across
>Brent? Well it's not like she had other things to do. She was still
>essentially a savage. (Except of course her apparent need to visit a
>good hairdresser and going for manicures now and then. )

So Nova returned to her tribe, despite Taylor telling her to go find Zira, and spent a few weeks or months with them. Then one day she was just out joyriding in the Forbidden Zone when she happened to run into Brent. Sorry but that really doesn't make any sense.

And to say that just because she knew the way to Ape City meant she knew where and how to find food & water is a total leap of logic.

While she may have been able to find enough food & water to sustain her and the horse for a few days beyond the supplies Taylor got from the Gorillas at the end of Planet; there is no way she found enough to sustain them for weeks or months.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
>
>
> Nobody can make any assertion regarding the timeframe between POTA and
> Beneath simply by saying that Nova and the horse looked none the worse
> in wear between the two scenes with her in both movies. Nova was
> nomadic by upbringing and would have known exactly where and how to
> find more food and water. The fact that when Brent urged her to go
> find Taylor she brought him right ape city proved that she was not
> lost at all and knew exactly where she was and thus also knew where to
> find food and water. She may in fact have even returned to whatever
> was left of her tribe or other scattered human groups. We know humans
> were still around and a problem for apes because Ursus was still
> ranting. Why was she roaming around the desert when she came across
> Brent? Well it's not like she had other things to do. She was still
> essentially a savage. (Except of course her apparent need to visit a
> good hairdresser and going for manicures now and then. )
>
> Dario
>

I'm completely with you on this, Dario. I think the timeframe
between films is definitely open to interpretation, and you've made a
very good case for it being more than a week.

"Don't speak to me in absolutes, all evidence is contestable."

It's all open to interpretation and you're of course free to interpret it any way you like, and others are free to argue with you.

My interpretation has always been "BENEATH is a mess," and I wish it was never made. I truly do.

-- Rory

----- Original Message -----
From: James <JamesA1102@...>
Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 11:29 am
Subject: [pota] Re: Digest Number 4232

>
> So Nova returned to her tribe, despite Taylor telling her to go find
> Zira, and spent a few weeks or months with them. Then one day she was
> just out joyriding in the Forbidden Zone when she happened to run
into
> Brent. Sorry but that really doesn't make any sense.
>
> And to say that just because she knew the way to Ape City meant
> she knew
> where and how to find food & water is a total leap of logic.
>
> While she may have been able to find enough food & water to
> sustain her
> and the horse for a few days beyond the supplies Taylor got from the
> Gorillas at the end of Planet; there is no way she found enough to
> sustain them for weeks or months.
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Nobody can make any assertion regarding the timeframe between
> POTA and
> > Beneath simply by saying that Nova and the horse looked none the
> worse> in wear between the two scenes with her in both movies.
> Nova was
> > nomadic by upbringing and would have known exactly where and how to
> > find more food and water. The fact that when Brent urged her to go
> > find Taylor she brought him right ape city proved that she was not
> > lost at all and knew exactly where she was and thus also knew
> where to
> > find food and water. She may in fact have even returned to whatever
> > was left of her tribe or other scattered human groups. We know
> humans> were still around and a problem for apes because Ursus was
> still> ranting. Why was she roaming around the desert when she
> came across
> > Brent? Well it's not like she had other things to do. She was still
> > essentially a savage. (Except of course her apparent need to
> visit a
> > good hairdresser and going for manicures now and then. )
> >
> > Dario
> >
>
>
>

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:

> From: m c <aboro3085@...>
> Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Beneath's days (Was: Blu-ray Disc Features)
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 2:52 AM
> *** I'm pretty much with you in saying the end of
> PLANET/BENEATH is just a few days... (It's certainly not
> months as some have claimed!) But in fairness to those who
> think that Taylor & Nova might have been out there more
> than a week to (approximately) 10 days or so, living on the
> rations given to them at the end of PLANET, they could have
> stretched it out a little longer... I mean in BENEATH, they
> do show them drinking at a desert water hole which indicates
> that they either A) Were stretching out the water given to
> them in their provisions, supplementing it with water they
> found along the way or B) Drank all of the water given to
> them at the end of PLANET and they were able to find
> occasional sources of drinkable water which sustained them.
> The biggest issue with the water is this: No matter how much
> water the gorillas gave them, the horse would need water too
> and no amount of water given to them as provisions would
> sustain a horse more than a day.
> There has to be some source of drinkable water along the
> way because their horse would need a lot of it and green
> feed too... The horse would soon die of dehydration or
> starvation would soon set in (making the horse too sick to
> use while on the verge of death). I'm not sure how good
> the water was along the shore line area where they see The
> Statue, but if that water was okay maybe the horse drank
> that... But as they moved deeper into The Forbidden Zone,
> and it did appear they moved in far from the shore, there
> had to be something to keep the horse alive and if the horse
> was sustained, maybe there was water and a food source
> (edible plants,maybe even small game like rabbits) that
> could keep Taylor and Nova alive... ***
>
> --- On Tue, 10/28/08, James <JamesA1102@...>
> wrote:
>
> From: James <JamesA1102@...>
> Subject: [pota] Re: Beneath's days (Was: Blu-ray Disc
> Features)
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2008, 9:34 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> They found some cache of food and water hidden in the
> middle of a desert?
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "rassmguy"
> <handleyr@...> wrote:
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "James"
> JamesA1102@ wrote:
> > > You're forgetting one thing. At the end of
> Planet Taylor requests
> > and is give food & water enough for him & Nova
> to survive for a week.
> >
> > Yeah, but that's easy to get around. Just as you
> figured out a way to
> > explain the dogtags, the same can be done here.
> I'll give it a shot,
> > for instance: They found more.
> >
> > There, see? Easy. :)
> >

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, LordTZer0@... <LordTZer0@...> wrote:

> From: LordTZer0@... <LordTZer0@...>
> Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Digest Number 4232
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 5:47 AM
> Thank you!
> My point exactly.
>
>
> In a message dated 10/28/2008 7:05:45 P.M. Central Daylight
> Time,
> handleyr@... writes:
>
> There's just too much
> that happens in the interim--the trial, the wedding, the
> pregnancy (I
> suppose one could argue that Zira was pregnant throughout
> Planet, but
> that clearly wasn't the writers' intention when the
> first film was
> made),
>
> **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All
> of your favorites,
> no registration required and great graphics – check it
> out!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
> http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
>
> I did not say the interim period was a few months.

Well that is the issue, whether Beneath took place a week or two after Planet or several months later.

> I said nobody can make any assertions about the time using her appearance, including
> myself.

Her appearance is tangental to the main point. Taylor & Nova had a week's worth of food & water at the end of Planet. They couldn't have survived for a signifigant lenth of time beyond that in a desert. Neither could the horse.

> I just said it could have been a long lenght of time and
> provided some possible scenarios. But she was not lost, that is for
> sure because she was able to bring Brent right to the city.

Agreed that she is not lost. It is apparent that she is on her way back to Ape City after losing Taylor when she encounters Brent. She wasn't wandering around the Forbidden Zone for several weeks or months.

> Whether she had already gone back to Zira as Taylor asked her is also
> unanswerable based on the movie dialog.

Yes it is. When Cornelius shows Brent the map he points out the last place they saw Taylor and Nova. Not just Taylor but Taylor and Nova. Plus when Nova shows up they react surprized to see her. Not as if she had visited them before.

> Another hint supporting the notion that a significant length of time
> did pass between Taylor wandering off with Nova and the arrival of
> Brent is the fact that Zira momentarily thought that Brent was Taylor.
> Not the kind of error she would have made if the span was only short
> period.

Except that as Zira noted in Planet all humans look alike to most apes. Brent does have a passing resemblance to Taylor, that's why James Franciscus was cast in the role. And she doesn't deliever the line as if she is sure is Taylor. Just the opposite. She delivers the line as a question. As if she expects Taylor to be with Nova but is doubtful because the human before her doesn't look right.

> I'm open to it being a male or female.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
> I think -- I sure as hell hope! -- APES will look much better. Â At
least the original anyway.
>

>
> Because Amazon lower the price of the box set, I expect to have it
in my hands in about a week and a day.
>
>
>
>
> -- RoryÂ
>

See I can say exactly the opposite. I never saw the Orangutan refered to as a female until I saw someone do it here. Before that I always assumed it was a male because they never showed females of other species.

I don't know for sure whether it is a male or female. The script says it is a male. For me, the visual evidence is inconclusive. All I'm asking is that those who are 100% sure that it is a female to please provide some evidence beyond "It looks like a female to me". For centuries based on the visual evidence everyone thought the world was flat. But just becaues everyone beleived that, didn't make it so.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Hunter Goatley <goathunter@...> wrote:
>
> I've always "known" it was a female. I never even considered that it
> could be male until this discussion. And I still think it's female.
>
> And I always believed the statue was buried.
>
> Hunter
>

Yes the Blu-Ray release will include the uncut version of Conquest. The extended version of Battle will also be included.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "kalel_x20" <kalel_x20@...> wrote:
>
> Any truth that POTA is coming to Blu-Ray complete with an UNCUT
> version of Conquest of the Planet of the Apes? Any idea if they've
> found the missing footage from Escape?
>

Also in Escape Zira tells Hasslein that she knew she was pregnant well before the war.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** It's pretty safe to say Zira was already expecting during BENEATH... Remember the line "At least our child when it's born won't be breast fed on bile". The way she says it in the film, it's not said like "when we have our child", it's said like she knows she's carrying. ***
>
> --- On Wed, 10/29/08, Tim "apefan" apefan23@... wrote:
>
> From: Tim "apefan" apefan23@...
> Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Digest Number 4232
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 11:40 AM
>
> How much time passes in Escape between their landing and Zira saying she's
> pregnant? Maybe they conceived after they were already here...
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Alex Ruiz <pota1968@...> wrote:
>
> The Master Plan:
> 1. Watch all the special features first.
> 2. Watch Conquest Unrated Version
> 3. Then have a Planet of the Apes HD Marathon that coming weekend.
(I'm off from work on weekends) :o)
>
> Oh yeah! :o)
>
> Al
>
>
>
>
>

That statement alone shows that there was no third ship. If he has a ship available he would have said "I've got to get out...yeah, gotta get back up there. I've got to get back to my ship and take off, but I'm not staying here...", but instead he says "I don't know how or what with". Thus, he didn't have a spare ship available to him. Plus earlier he says to the Skipper, 'our computer's shot'; not your computer or my computer but our computer. If their were two ships each would need it's own computer. So if there was only one computer there was only one ship.

Earlier today I visited Ansanaut's site and found that he is in the process of re-writing Rod Serling's & Michael Wilson's final script to Planet. That is total arrogant self-indulgence on his part. POTA is a classic film. Not even Tim Burton was presumptuous enough to rewrite and remake it. What's next? His recut of Casablanca with a new happier ending?

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "zasco1957" <Zasco1957@...> wrote:
>
> Okay, M.C...can I say that I think that possibly Brent flew the ship? He
> did say in BENEATH, after witnessing the speech given by General Ursus, "I
> ve got to get out...yeah, gotta get back up there. I don't know how or what
> with, but I'm not staying here..."
>
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "zasco1957" <Zasco1957@...> wrote:

Okay, M.C...can I say that I think that possibly Brent flew the
ship?

*** Yes, if that goes along with your opinion that there is another
ship you're more than welcome to add that to your/Chris' theories.

But, even with your thought that Brent flew the ship, it still leaves
my question unanswered: What hppened to the other crew members?
You're of the opinion that Brent commanded a three seated ship, so
he'd be one crew member: Where are the other two? And if the ship
you're alleging was commanded by "Skipper" was of equal capacity,
that'd leave an additional two astronauts? We're looking at
potentially four more astronauts, all unaccounted for if the "third
ship" theory is to be believed... Can you account for their
whereabouts? ***


He did say in BENEATH, after witnessing the speech given by General
Ursus, "I've got to get out...yeah, gotta get back up there. I don't
know how or what with, but I'm not staying here..."

*** True, he did say that, and with that line, you answered your own
question... You asked/stated this:

<<< What I'm asking is why would Brent have made that remark if he
too didn't have a fully functional spacecraft? I think that he would
have had to accepted the cold, hard facts that "he was there to
stay", much as Taylor and his crew did after their own ship crashed
and sank into that lake. >>>

*** Brent states that he "doesn't know how or what with", which
clearly indicates that he knows he does not have a functional craft
of any type to get back into space... If he had a ship at his
disposal, he'd probably have stated something more along the lines
of "I have to get out of here... Yeah, I need to get back to the ship
and up there again"... But he knows he has no way to "get back up
there"... And regarding Taylor and his crew, Taylor is the one that
accepted the cold hard fact that they were there to stay... Landon
still didn't totally buy what Taylor said and with that in mind, he
probably thought they had a snowball's chance in he*l of getting
back... ***

To me, Brent seemed as if he were a very nervous, sensitive person
who was possibly "wigging out" after what he'd been through so far in
the movie.

*** This I can agree with. I'm not sure he's quite at the point of
going insane, but I could agree that he seems on the verge at times,
and with just cause. ***


His commander's disastrous flight, his ship crashed and burned. He
finds out that he's twenty centuries into the future. Skipper dies
shortly afterwards. Brent finds a half-nude woman on a horse, wearing
the tags of the very person that they'd been in search of! They
encounter Ape City where Brent witnesses humans in cages and talking
gorillas.

*** As I said above, these "facts" could make someone "wig out"...
Again, I'm not sure if Brent is going insane or not but the examples
as you stated them here are reason to be. ***

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, James <JamesA1102@...> wrote: Earlier today I visited Ansanaut's site and found that he is in the process of re-writing Rod Serling's & Michael Wilson's final script to Planet. That is total arrogant self-indulgence on his part. POTA is a classic film. Not even Tim Burton was presumptuous enough to rewrite and remake it.   *** I agree with you on this all the way, especially regarding PLANET... PLANET is the one film that shouldn't be tampered with at all... It's the originator and as Rory has said in the past, it deserves to be treated as a stand alone film... I like the sequels and all, but if they only made PLANET, that would have been okay with me...   You also seem to think PLANET shouldn't be messed with (and rightly so), so I have to ask: How do you and the others here feel about the audio drama of PLANET produced by BrokenSeas? I'm not trying to start any type of "war" here, and I am NOT singling BrokenSeas out, but being their's is the first retelling of PLANET that I know of (unless you count the POWER records adaption or the MARVEL comic version) I'm wondering how you (and everybody else) feel about their "retelling/rewriting" as opposed to what the ANSANAUT sites "rewriting/retelling" will be?   I know the BrokenSeas adaption took a lot of liberties with the material, and based on what I've seen, I know ANSANAUT's rewrite will do equally as much rewriting, if not more... Where do you stand on this issue and how, if it all, do you differentiate between the two retellings of PLANET? *** ***,___

What BrokenSea did was an adaptation into a different medium, like Marvel adapting the film to comics. When doing an adaptation a certain amount of changes are necessary to fit into the new medium. If someone wanted to do a stage version of the film a certain amount of rewriting would be need to adapt to that medium. There is nothing wrong with that otherwise you would never have comic adaptations or novelizations.

What Ansanaut is doing on his site is rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories. That is very different from what Marvel or BrokenSea has done.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** I agree with you on this all the way, especially regarding PLANET... PLANET is the one film that shouldn't be tampered with at all... It's the originator and as Rory has said in the past, it deserves to be treated as a stand alone film... I like the sequels and all, but if they only made PLANET, that would have been okay with me...
>  
> You also seem to think PLANET shouldn't be messed with (and rightly so), so I have to ask: How do you and the others here feel about the audio drama of PLANET produced by BrokenSeas? I'm not trying to start any type of "war" here, and I am NOT singling BrokenSeas out, but being their's is the first retelling of PLANET that I know of (unless you count the POWER records adaption or the MARVEL comic version) I'm wondering how you (and everybody else) feel about their "retelling/rewriting" as opposed to what the ANSANAUT sites "rewriting/retelling" will be?
>  
> I know the BrokenSeas adaption took a lot of liberties with the material, and based on what I've seen, I know ANSANAUT's rewrite will do equally as much rewriting, if not more... Where do you stand on this issue and how, if it all, do you differentiate between the two retellings of PLANET? ***
> ***,___
>

Which is why when she said "Taylor", she said it as a question and not a statement.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> And they're both completely
> different height, build, hairline, etc . . .
>
>
>
> In a message dated 10/29/2008 1:45:38 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> JamesA1102@... writes:
>
> Except that as Zira noted in Planet all humans look alike to most apes.
> Brent does have a passing resemblance to Taylor, that's why James Franciscus was
> cast in the role.
>
> **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check out Today's Hot
> 5 Travel Deals!
> (http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
>

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 6:52 AM, James <JamesA1102@...> wrote:

What BrokenSea did was an adaptation into a different medium, like Marvel adapting the film to comics. When doing an adaptation a certain amount of changes are necessary to fit into the new medium. If someone wanted to do a stage version of the film a certain amount of rewriting would be need to adapt to that medium. There is nothing wrong with that otherwise you would never have comic adaptations or novelizations.

What Ansanaut is doing on his site is rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories. That is very different from what Marvel or BrokenSea has done.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** I agree with you on this all the way, especially regarding PLANET... PLANET is the one film that shouldn't be tampered with at all... It's the originator and as Rory has said in the past, it deserves to be treated as a stand alone film... I like the sequels and all, but if they only made PLANET, that would have been okay with me...
>  
> You also seem to think PLANET shouldn't be messed with (and rightly so), so I have to ask: How do you and the others here feel about the audio drama of PLANET produced by BrokenSeas? I'm not trying to start any type of "war" here, and I am NOT singling BrokenSeas out, but being their's is the first retelling of PLANET that I know of (unless you count the POWER records adaption or the MARVEL comic version) I'm wondering how you (and everybody else) feel about their "retelling/rewriting" as opposed to what the ANSANAUT sites "rewriting/retelling" will be?
>  
> I know the BrokenSeas adaption took a lot of liberties with the material, and based on what I've seen, I know ANSANAUT's rewrite will do equally as much rewriting, if not more... Where do you stand on this issue and how, if it all, do you differentiate between the two retellings of PLANET? ***
> ***,___
>

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

----- Original Message -----

From: Alex Ruiz

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2008 9:27 PM

Subject: [pota] PLANET OF THE MEN

PLANET OF THE MEN (fan made mini-movie)

A little blast from the past. :o)

 

http://www.potacoll ective.com/ fans/planet_ of_the_men. wmv

 

Enjoy.

Al

 

---

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.7.4/1695 - Release Date: 27/09/2008 13:11

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "drhasslein" <drhasslein@...> wrote:
>
> I absolutely agree with what James said.
>
> There is a difference between Rory asking what happened to the tree
> between films and someone replying that it was cut down to make a
> battering ram (which is not self indulgent, it is feasable to fit
> into the tale) and as James said a revisionist explanation by someone
> that believes the boundaries of the tale do not apply to them -
> that's very self indulgent.
>
> IMHO, It NEEDS no explanation, but I have no problem with
> speculation, as long as you don't throw out the guidelines...
>
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Rich Handley <handleyr@> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Well, in fairness, all of us who frequent this
> > > and other POTA groups are no less indulgent than
> > > someone who creates a fansite based on a pet
> > > theory. If POTA needs no explanation because it
> > > just is, then there's no point to having any
> > > groups or sites devoted to the
> > > franchise--including this one.
>

On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 3:29 PM, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:

*** How is it different though? BrokenSeas adapted it into audio, Ansanaut is adapting it into the written word... They're both different forms of media, and by Bill's own admission, he took a lot of liberties and no doubt ANSANAUT will too... "Liberties" or as you call it, "rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories", both guys tampered with the source material to have it include things they wanted to see... Both changed/will change things to have it include things they wanted to see in the film's story: Can you tell me what the difference is? *** --- On Thu, 10/30/08, James <JamesA1102@...> wrote: From: James <JamesA1102@...> Subject: [pota] Re: Rewriting a classic To: pota@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, October 30, 2008, 6:52 AM What BrokenSea did was an adaptation into a different medium, like Marvel adapting the film to comics. When doing an adaptation a certain amount of changes are necessary to fit into the new medium. If someone wanted to do a stage version of the film a certain amount of rewriting would be need to adapt to that medium. There is nothing wrong with that otherwise you would never have comic adaptations or novelizations. What Ansanaut is doing on his site is rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories. That is very different from what Marvel or BrokenSea has done. --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote: > > *** I agree with you on this all the way, especially regarding PLANET... PLANET is the one film that shouldn't be tampered with at all... It's the originator and as Rory has said in the past, it deserves to be treated as a stand alone film... I like the sequels and all, but if they only made PLANET, that would have been okay with me... >   > You also seem to think PLANET shouldn't be messed with (and rightly so), so I have to ask: How do you and the others here feel about the audio drama of PLANET produced by BrokenSeas? I'm not trying to start any type of "war" here, and I am NOT singling BrokenSeas out, but being their's is the first retelling of PLANET that I know of (unless you count the POWER records adaption or the MARVEL comic version) I'm wondering how you (and everybody else) feel about their "retelling/rewriting" as opposed to what the ANSANAUT sites "rewriting/retelling" will be? >   > I know the BrokenSeas adaption took a lot of liberties with the material, and based on what I've seen, I know ANSANAUT's rewrite will do equally as much rewriting, if not more... Where do you stand on this issue and how, if it all, do you differentiate between the two retellings of PLANET? *** > ***,___ >

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

No Ansanaut is not adapting it into written word. He is taking the existing shooting script and rewriting it. Now it is obvious that you don't like BrokenSea's adaptation, which is your right, but what they are doing it not the same thing.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** How is it different though? BrokenSeas adapted it into audio, Ansanaut is adapting it into the written word... They're both different forms of media, and by Bill's own admission, he took a lot of liberties and no doubt ANSANAUT will too... "Liberties" or as you call it, "rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories", both guys tampered with the source material to have it include things they wanted to see... Both changed/will change things to have it include things they wanted to see in the film's story: Can you tell me what the difference is? ***
>

I would say that is a big difference too. BrokenSea's adaptation added background and depth to what was already there. They didn't not go back and rewrite whole scenes and passages of dialogue. Everyone may not care for what BrokenSea did. But some may not have cared for what Power Records or Marvel did with their adaptations.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Hollweg" <billhollweg@...> wrote:
>
> In my case the script parts were 95% intact or so. Other than the addition
> of the talking computer to make the opening sequence with taylor work a
> little better along with the crash- all my additions were extra scenes
> basically. What I thought was going on while the movie was playing etc.
>

Mike let's be honest. I've gone on record here and elsewhere as hating BrokenSea's adaptation. Now you are going out of your way to make this an issue by drawing a false equivalency between BrokenSea doing an Audio adaptation of the material into a different medium, which by it's nature requires a certain amount of changes to work in that medium, and Ansanaut's rewriting of the Serling's & Wilson's script posted on his site. That's the difference, reworking something to in order to present it in a different medium vs. just rewriting because you think you can do a better job than the original screenwriters.

BrokenSea added some material based on what was later presented as part of the backstory in the sequels but as Bill stated, 95% of the Planet script remained in tact. In Cornelius' Journal and other works of fan fiction the same thing was done. Certain elements, such as the backstory of Milo finding and repairing Taylor's ship, were presented concurrent with events that took place on screen. However, in no way was the content of what was presented on screen changed other than to fit it into a different medium. That's the differance, adding some of the backstory as opposed to changing the main story.

Ansanaut is not adapting the script to another medium. If he were doing a novelization of the script that would be different. But he is not doing that. Or maybe it would be different if he were just adding scenes to conform with the backstory from the later films. (I.E. Inserting a scene after Taylor is captured where Cornelius meets with Milo and tells him Taylor's story.) But that is not what he is doing. He is changing whole swaths of existing dialogue and mostly doing so to conform to his own pet theories. Several people have brought up Patrick Tilton's mega-novel. While Patrick may have changed the meaning of some of the dialogue as in what some characters are refering to when they say 'Earth'; at least Patrick respects canon enough to have not changed the original dialogue to have them say 'Mothership' instead. That's what is the difference, having a different interpetation of the dialogue vs. actually changing the dialogue.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c <aboro3085@...> wrote:
>
> *** Right now, I'm not saying anything pro or con about the BrokenSeas audio story... What I'm asking is where do you differentiate between what is an "adaption" and what is a "rewrite"...
>  
> By Bill's own post he said when he wrote his script, his additional things were what he thought might have been happening while the film was occuring, how exactly does that differ from what ANSANAUT will be doing? He is going to be taking the existing material and adding his "third ship" type ideas to the script... It's obvious from my posts regarding the whole "third ship" thing that I do not agree with what Chris will be doing to PLANET, but from the way I took what you posted last night, he will be rewriting the PLANET script to fit his ideas on the ships (and possibly Taylor and Brent's missions?), not rewriting the entire story...
>  
> How do you say one is okay and one isn't when both alter PLANET for their author's reasons... Bill altered it by adding some "backstory" type material... Shields will be altering it to make it fit his theories on the ships and the mission... What is the difference? I really don't get where you're coming from? ***
>
>
> --- On Thu, 10/30/08, James JamesA1102@... wrote:
>
> From: James JamesA1102@...
> Subject: [pota] Re: Rewriting a classic
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, October 30, 2008, 5:10 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> No Ansanaut is not adapting it into written word. He is taking the existing shooting script and rewriting it. Now it is obvious that you don't like BrokenSea's adaptation, which is your right, but what they are doing it not the same thing.
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, m c aboro3085@ wrote:
> >
> > *** How is it different though? BrokenSeas adapted it into audio, Ansanaut is adapting it into the written word... They're both different forms of media, and by Bill's own admission, he took a lot of liberties and no doubt ANSANAUT will too... "Liberties" or as you call it, "rewriting the film script in order to fit in his own pet theories", both guys tampered with the source material to have it include things they wanted to see... Both changed/will change things to have it include things they wanted to see in the film's story: Can you tell me what the difference is? ***
> >
>

On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 6:33 AM, James <JamesA1102@...> wrote:

Happy Halloween everyone! Since it is also Friday, the next installment of THE ILLUSTRATED MONKEY PLANET is now available. Thanks again to Dave Ballard.

To read the page click on the banner on the Yahoo Home page or use this link: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/MPC.htm

BTW since it is Halloween if you could be made up and costumed as any character from the POTA franchise, who would it be? For me it would be General Ursus. Just love that hat!

Have a great weekend everyone!

Visit all the Group's special features including:

• The Group Website  - Original POTA One Sheets & Lobby Cards, Trailers & Rare Videos, Trading Cards and much, much more.
• POTA Locations  - The places where the POTA films were shot.
• Cornelius' Journal  - The Memoirs of Dr. Cornelius.
• Lessons from the Lawgiver – Words of wisdom from the Greatest Ape of All.
• The Art Gallery  - Works of POTA Art by our members.
• The Database Section  - POTA info ranging from Characters to Comics.
• The Photos Section  - POTA pics contributed by members.

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

The only good stockbroker is a dead stockbroker!

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Alex Ruiz <pota1968@...> wrote:
>
> Apemania in New York?
> http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/bizarre&id=6468795
>
> Al
>

--- On Fri, 10/31/08, Alex Ruiz <pota1968@...> wrote:

> From: Alex Ruiz <pota1968@...>
> Subject: Re: [pota] New Sideshow???
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Friday, October 31, 2008, 6:25 AM
> Sounds great.
>
> Al
>
>
>
>
>

I wouldn't think Rachel Ray's audience is the right target group.

For those who have the G4 network, Attack of the Show is doing something on Monday.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Alex Ruiz <pota1968@...> wrote:
>
> An audience member in ape makeup and blu-ray sets for the entire audience?
> Sounds to me like a FOX promotional gig.
>
> I guess it's cheaper than making a Blu-ray Commercial. lol :o) 
>
> Al
>
>
>
> > From: drhasslein drhasslein@...
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, October 31, 2008 11:06:21 AM
> Subject: [pota] Rachel Ray
>
>
> I haven't seen it yet because I am on the West Coast, but today's
> Rachel Ray featured an audience member in ape makeup and she gave the
> blu-ray set to the entire audience.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, goapebilly@... wrote:
>
> good luck trying to watch show,i find i cant watch even for a
minute,w/out
> running head into wall to stop the pain.but from what i could
stomach they
> werent really on show at all.thats smart give free blue ray to
middle age house
> wives who couldn't give a damn about or appreciate them. goapebilly
>
>
> In a message dated 10/31/2008 11:44:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> drhasslein@... writes:
>
>
>
>
> I haven't seen it yet because I am on the West Coast, but today's
> Rachel Ray featured an audience member in ape makeup and she gave
the
> blu-ray set to the entire audience.
>
>
>
>
> **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check out
Today's Hot
> 5 Travel Deals!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212416248x1200771803/aol?
redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
>

> If you go to Deep Discount DVD, Blu Ray Apes is only 104$ I already
> preordered mine!

--- On Fri, 10/31/08, drhasslein <drhasslein@...> wrote:

> From: drhasslein <drhasslein@...>
> Subject: [pota] Re: Rachel Ray
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Friday, October 31, 2008, 4:08 PM
> Actually, apemania was there, and it was Coby from Survivor
> they put
> in makeup, not an audience member... Maybe the audience
> will put the
> sets on ebay really cheap!
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, goapebilly@... wrote:
> >
> > good luck trying to watch show,i find i cant watch
> even for a
> minute,w/out
> > running head into wall to stop the pain.but from what
> i could
> stomach they
> > werent really on show at all.thats smart give free
> blue ray to
> middle age house
> > wives who couldn't give a damn about or appreciate
> them. goapebilly
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 10/31/2008 11:44:43 A.M. Eastern
> Daylight Time,
> > drhasslein@... writes:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I haven't seen it yet because I am on the West
> Coast, but today's
> > Rachel Ray featured an audience member in ape makeup
> and she gave
> the
> > blu-ray set to the entire audience.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel.
> Check out
> Today's Hot
> > 5 Travel Deals!
> >
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212416248x1200771803/aol?
> redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
> >

--- On Fri, 10/31/08, Tim "apefan" <apefan23@...> wrote:

> From: Tim "apefan" <apefan23@...>
> Subject: [PotaDG] Apemania on Rachel Ray
> To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Friday, October 31, 2008, 4:33 PM
> Here's Colby from the Rachel Ray show getting made up by
> Brian P from Apemania complete with Goldsmith score!
>
> http://www.rachaelrayshow.com/show/segments/view/monkeying-around-colby/

I just saw the show. It looked like the Apemania crew handing out treats with Colby made up as Caesar. They seemed to have a whole Ape theme going. Rachel Ray was dressed like Fay Ray from King Kong. I found her very annoying. Kept hoping Gordon Ramsey would show up and tell her what a loser she is.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "drhasslein" <drhasslein@...> wrote:
>
> Actually, apemania was there, and it was Coby from Survivor they put
> in makeup, not an audience member... Maybe the audience will put the
> sets on ebay really cheap!
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, goapebilly@ wrote:
> >
> > good luck trying to watch show,i find i cant watch even for a
> minute,w/out
> > running head into wall to stop the pain.but from what i could
> stomach they
> > werent really on show at all.thats smart give free blue ray to
> middle age house
> > wives who couldn't give a damn about or appreciate them. goapebilly
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 10/31/2008 11:44:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> > drhasslein@ writes:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I haven't seen it yet because I am on the West Coast, but today's
> > Rachel Ray featured an audience member in ape makeup and she gave
> the
> > blu-ray set to the entire audience.
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
>

Thanks Tim!

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Tim \"apefan\"" <apefan23@...> wrote:
>
> Just posted some screen caps in the Photos section under Rachel Ray.
>