SCOTT FRANK TELLS CHUD "I'M NOT REMAKING CONQUEST OF THE PLANET OF THE APES!"

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "smagelowitz" <smagelowitz@...> wrote:
>
> Hey all, I am new to this forum, but it's got a ton of great
> information on Planet of the Apes, which is exactly what I am looking
> for. I need to write a paper for my rhetorical criticism class on
> planet of the apes and the lens I chose to use was metaphorical
> criticism. Does anyone have any ideas for me? Basically, I need to
> use the metaphors in this movie to come up with an idea that will be
> the length of 15 pages. I am currently thinking of relating it to the
> idea that a lot of the metaphors represent the African American
> struggle in the U.S. society in the 60s and onward. Thanks a lot for
> taking your time, I appreciate any advice.
>
> -Steve
>

All of the changes in Conquest are in the last third of the movie during the ape revolt. Most of the changes make the film more violent such as apes and at least one human guard getting shot in the face.

In one scene as the apes are breaking into the command center Breck shoots a gorilla in the face.

The end is different. Lisa doesn't say no and the second half of Caesar's speech doesn't happen. Instead the Apes beat Breck to death. (Or presumably to death since it is hard to image he survived.)

As far as Battle it was the same extended version available in the legacy collection. A list of all the additions is here: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/Battle%20Uncut.doc

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@...> wrote:
>
>
> I missed most of last weekends conquest and battle movies.I did see
> some extra footage of conquest with the cut violence.what else did I
> miss from conquest? Plus how much extra footage of battle?
>
> Ron
>

Not a lot. They are only discussed in final chapter of the book, most of which is dedicated to episode guides of each series.

However, I would still recommend the book to POTA fans. It contains several reprints of interviews and articles from the early 70s when the films were being produced.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Marshall" <mgreythorne@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> 2 messages in a day, must be a full moon.
>
>
>
> The book synopsis says there is discussion on the animated series and
> comics. Can anyone advise the degree of depth.
>
>
>
> Ta
>
>
>
> MG
>

>For what it's worth, Mort Abrahams told me the statue of

> I haven't seen the doc, but good to know it was finally
> acknowledged... I never bought the APJAC & Blake Edwards deli

> everyone always wants to take credit for a great idea.
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Chris Lawless <lawford42@> wrote:
> >
> > Believed to have inspired Serling to come up with the ending to
> PLANET,
> > though of course there are others who claim credit as well.
> Interesting
> > that this was included in the 'Evolution of the Apes' documentary.
> >
> > Chris L.
> >
> >
> >
> > "drhasslein" <drhasslein@> wrote:
> >
> > >>My second favorite episode, the first season's "I Shot an Arrow
> into
> > the Air" doesn't have POTA actors, but has the POTA twist... <<
> >
>

>Posted by: "Robert Murt" deady08520@... deady08520
>I just got my book yesterday and at first glance, I would say it
>looks and reads great. Wonderful cover art and easy to read
>timeline. A fine looking project overall.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Hollweg" <billhollweg@...> wrote:
>
> THIS is gonna be a GREAT CHRISTMAS!!!
>
> --
> Bill Hollweg
> Have Sword...
> Will Slay...
> Barbarian in need of Ale...
> Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
> Bill Hollweg
> Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
> www.brokensea.net
> The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
> Planet of the Apes at
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
> http://brokensea.com/conan/
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@...> wrote:
>
> I love the way people today liberally take from a already made
concept and then have gaul to called "New", "Original", "Fresh".
Bullsh*t. These no talent hacks can't think of a real original story
so build upon something which already exists. Common! Out of all the
names he could have used he has to use "Caesar" This is another re-
bout.
> - Scott
>

The boxset has all 14 episodes from the TV series in their original episode form. Since the TV movies were edited from the original episodes it contains all the footage plus anything that was cut when they cobbled together the TV movies.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@...> wrote:
>
> I still have not got the apes tv series box set.Is all the footage
> shown last weekend on the fox movie channel on it?,or are those movies
> not on the dvd box set? Help? I was watching those movies for the first
> time,except for "back to the planet of the apes" that one has been on
> tv now and then.I really enjoyed watching some of the other 4 apes tv
> series movies.It was like watching a brand new apes film.I don't
> remember seeing them as a kid.I am going to finally buy the set this
> week!!!
>
> Ronnie
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Marshall" <mgreythorne@...> wrote:
>
> Ordered on Nov 26
>
>
>
> Received confirmation of shipping on Dec 2
>
>
>
> Received at doorstep in Australia on Dec 3.
>
>
>
> It looks like a fantastic book and I look forward to reading it.
>
>
>
> I love its presentation
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "James" <JamesA1102@...> wrote:
>
>
> The boxset has all 14 episodes from the TV series in their original
> episode form. Since the TV movies were edited from the original
episodes
> it contains all the footage plus anything that was cut when they
cobbled
> together the TV movies.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@> wrote:
> >
> > I still have not got the apes tv series box set.Is all the footage
> > shown last weekend on the fox movie channel on it?,or are those
movies
> > not on the dvd box set? Help? I was watching those movies for the
> first
> > time,except for "back to the planet of the apes" that one has
been on
> > tv now and then.I really enjoyed watching some of the other 4
apes tv
> > series movies.It was like watching a brand new apes film.I don't
> > remember seeing them as a kid.I am going to finally buy the set
this
> > week!!!
> >
> > Ronnie
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Marshall" <mgreythorne@...> wrote:
>
> Ordered on Nov 26
>
>
>
> Received confirmation of shipping on Dec 2
>
>
>
> Received at doorstep in Australia on Dec 3.
>
>
>
> It looks like a fantastic book and I look forward to reading it.
>
>
>
> I love its presentation
>

Essentially low ratings. Also the network cited poor demograghics too. The audience was mainly children and teens with hardly any viewers over 50. If anyone saw Boston Legal last night, oh how the world has changed.

BTW Did anyone note the POTA connection in last night's episode?

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks for info.I will buy it this week(apes tv series box set)what
> does everyone think about the tv series? Why did it last just 14
> episods?
> Ron
>
>

Here is the link to Lulu: http://www.lulu.com/content/4923702

Definitely a must have book for all POTA fans.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "zasco1957" <Zasco1957@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, James and my fellow Apesters...I haven't been online for three weeks, I
> had to get a new monitor in the last day or so.
>
>
>
> I'm still trying to get a copy of the Timeline...can anyone direct me to the
> right place where I could order one?
>
>
>
> Thanks...Zach
>
>
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
>
>
> From: James
>
> Date: 12/2/2008 9:58:34 AM
>
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
>
> Subject: [pota] Re: Metaphor Criticism Paper
>
>
>
> You might want to take a look at this: https://pota.goatley
> com/scripts/pota_teachguide.pdf
>
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "smagelowitz" smagelowitz@ wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Hey all, I am new to this forum, but it's got a ton of great
>
> > information on Planet of the Apes, which is exactly what I am looking
>
> > for. I need to write a paper for my rhetorical criticism class on
>
> > planet of the apes and the lens I chose to use was metaphorical
>
> > criticism. Does anyone have any ideas for me? Basically, I need to
>
> > use the metaphors in this movie to come up with an idea that will be
>
> > the length of 15 pages. I am currently thinking of relating it to the
>
> > idea that a lot of the metaphors represent the African American
>
> > struggle in the U.S. society in the 60s and onward. Thanks a lot for
>
> > taking your time, I appreciate any advice.
>
> >
>
> > -Steve
>
> >
>

>>All interesting thoughts Chris! I made a list of thoughts while

>>Wow! It's like a whole different movie

> I'm still trying to get a copy of the Timeline...can anyone direct

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "James" <JamesA1102@...> wrote:
>
> You might want to take a look at this:
> https://pota.goatley.com/scripts/pota_teachguide.pdf
> <https://pota.goatley.com/scripts/pota_teachguide.pdf>
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "smagelowitz" <smagelowitz@> wrote:
> >
> > Hey all, I am new to this forum, but it's got a ton of great
> > information on Planet of the Apes, which is exactly what I am looking
> > for. I need to write a paper for my rhetorical criticism class on
> > planet of the apes and the lens I chose to use was metaphorical
> > criticism. Does anyone have any ideas for me? Basically, I need to
> > use the metaphors in this movie to come up with an idea that will be
> > the length of 15 pages. I am currently thinking of relating it to the
> > idea that a lot of the metaphors represent the African American
> > struggle in the U.S. society in the 60s and onward. Thanks a lot for
> > taking your time, I appreciate any advice.
> >
> > -Steve
> >
>

----- Original Message -----

From: James

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 3:52 PM

Subject: [pota] Re: apes tv series box set

The boxset has all 14 episodes from the TV series in their original episode form. Since the TV movies were edited from the original episodes it contains all the footage plus anything that was cut when they cobbled together the TV movies.

--- In pota@yahoogroups. com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@. ..> wrote:
>
> I still have not got the apes tv series box set.Is all the footage
> shown last weekend on the fox movie channel on it?,or are those movies
> not on the dvd box set? Help? I was watching those movies for the first
> time,except for "back to the planet of the apes" that one has been on
> tv now and then.I really enjoyed watching some of the other 4 apes tv
> series movies.It was like watching a brand new apes film.I don't
> remember seeing them as a kid.I am going to finally buy the set this
> week!!!
>
> Ronnie
>

----- Original Message -----

From: Alex Ruiz

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:11 PM

Subject: [pota] Scott Frank

So far everything I'm hearing from Scott Frank is great.

Not a Conquest remake but rather a whole new saga. If all goes well, this thing may just turn out to be as big as another Star Wars type saga.

An entire storyline layed out to be issued in many films. A trilogy or possibly 2 trilogies (at least this is my impression).

 

I'm really glad that to see that Fox is looking at the long run and not just one story, one movie.

And with Scott being a lifelong Planet of the Apes fan, it makes it even better.  

It's all good.

 

Al

 

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> I agree, give the guy a chance. Sounds like he wants to do right
by POTA. And it seems like he's pumped to get started. He's the Obama
of POTA. Change we can believe in.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Alex Ruiz
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:11 PM
> Subject: [pota] Scott Frank
>
>
>
> So far everything I'm hearing from Scott Frank is great.
> Not a Conquest remake but rather a whole new saga. If all goes
well, this thing may just turn out to be as big as another Star Wars
type saga.
> An entire storyline layed out to be issued in many films. A
trilogy or possibly 2 trilogies (at least this is my impression).
>
> I'm really glad that to see that Fox is looking at the long run
and not just one story, one movie.
> And with Scott being a lifelong Planet of the Apes fan, it makes
it even better.
>
> It's all good.
>
> Al
>

>>During the scenes where the apes are gathering their weapons in

>> Ditto for the scene after Caesar find out about Armando and

>>I also never remembered the scene where- after the first armed

----- Original Message -----

From: ronnie2467

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:52 PM

Subject: [pota] Re: Scott Frank

where did you here this?I think it would be great to have a pota
trilogy,why not! I whole new generation for the apes films.I
agree,not just one apes film.That's the thing about the apes
films,you can't just make one film.

--- In pota@yahoogroups. com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> I agree, give the guy a chance. Sounds like he wants to do right
by POTA. And it seems like he's pumped to get started. He's the Obama
of POTA. Change we can believe in.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Alex Ruiz
> To: pota@yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:11 PM
> Subject: [pota] Scott Frank
>
>
>
> So far everything I'm hearing from Scott Frank is great.
> Not a Conquest remake but rather a whole new saga. If all goes
well, this thing may just turn out to be as big as another Star Wars
type saga.
> An entire storyline layed out to be issued in many films. A
trilogy or possibly 2 trilogies (at least this is my impression).
>
> I'm really glad that to see that Fox is looking at the long run
and not just one story, one movie.
> And with Scott being a lifelong Planet of the Apes fan, it makes
it even better.
>
> It's all good.
>
> Al
>

>
> I agree, give the guy a chance. Sounds like he wants to do right

>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Alex Ruiz
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:11 PM
> Subject: [pota] Scott Frank
>
>
>
> So far everything I'm hearing from Scott Frank is great.
> Not a Conquest remake but rather a whole new saga. If all goes

> An entire storyline layed out to be issued in many films. A

>
> I'm really glad that to see that Fox is looking at the long run

> And with Scott being a lifelong Planet of the Apes fan, it makes

>
> It's all good.
>
> Al
>

Just as an FYI here is Scott Frank's wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Frank He does have an impressive list of writing credits.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "shanter2002" <john@...> wrote:
>
> I'm always insanely excited to have any whiff of news about an Apes
> movie.I don't know much about Scott Frank, but if guys like Alex and
> Jeff are fine with him, I'm fine with him too.I'm terrified of CGI
> and I ache with frustration when you think what a Tim Roth Caesar
> could have been like.Personally, I think a Conquest scenario is a
> great place to start--I've always thought Jakes' novel gave the story
> a sweep and scale that budget restrictions didn't allow for in the
> movie.My plea is let's have proper make-up, a la Chambers, with
> minimal CGI and maximum script.It's suddenly VERY exciting being an
> Apesfan.John, Scrolls.
> >
> > I agree, give the guy a chance. Sounds like he wants to do right
> by POTA. And it seems like he's pumped to get started. He's the Obama
> of POTA. Change we can believe in.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Alex Ruiz
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:11 PM
> > Subject: [pota] Scott Frank
> >
> >
> >
> > So far everything I'm hearing from Scott Frank is great.
> > Not a Conquest remake but rather a whole new saga. If all goes
> well, this thing may just turn out to be as big as another Star Wars
> type saga.
> > An entire storyline layed out to be issued in many films. A
> trilogy or possibly 2 trilogies (at least this is my impression).
> >
> > I'm really glad that to see that Fox is looking at the long run
> and not just one story, one movie.
> > And with Scott being a lifelong Planet of the Apes fan, it makes
> it even better.
> >
> > It's all good.
> >
> > Al
> >
>

Very interesting points Chris.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Chris Lawless <lawford42@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> * Probably the most noticeable thing (to me, anyway) is the lack of
> pacing in the third act of the original version. The consensus seems to
> be that it was never intended to be the final edit, but the version that
> ultimately came out is much more polished and has a better flow to the
> story. Most notably during the revolt. In the theatrical version, you get
> the impression that the apes were systematically working through the
> city, section by section, towards the Command Post and there was a clear
> sense of tension being built. In the original cut, it felt more like
> shootout, ambush, shootout, ambush, ambush, riot, then BOOM- they're
> cutting the door down.
>

Agreed. It does not look as polished as the theatrical cut of the film. I believe this was the version tested in Phoenix and it is rare that the cut made for a test screening is the same cut released to theaters. Even if a test screening has a very positive response they always do some final tweaking.

>
> * Much as I enjoyed Tom Scott's score, I'm beginning to see why they
> opted for silence during a lot of the scenes. One thing that struck me
> repeatedly was that 60's sounding mutated organ loop that you heard as
> the command post was near to being attacked and the door cut through.
> While effective in it's own right, it really didn't work there.
>

Again, agreed. The music during that scene is rather intrusive.

>
> * As far as the repeated face shooting goes, the scene that struck me the
> most was the one in the command post where Breck shoots a gorilla point
> blank in the face. To me, that was pure 70's violence exploitation
> cinema. It was just SO over the top, even down to the fear reaction in
> the gorilla's face and his (almost) shaking his head no, pleading with
> Breck. Then a close up to the gun, Breck goes out of focus, and BLAM!! If
> you get right down to it, the gorilla shouldn't have even known what a
> gun was. The entire scene was both gratuitous and unnecessary.

One thing I noticed in that scene is when the gorilla is shot his blood splatters on to the shirt of the guard hold him. Yet when the guard gets up and turns to line up with the other guards to confront the remaining apes his shirt is clean.
> 
> 
> Presumably when CONQUEST was being filmed there were no definite plans
> for a fifth film, and certainly not to have the character of Breck
> continue on. So after the film gets changed to what we know as the
> theatrical version, Breck was still a viable character and was used in
> the EPIC OF THE PLANET OF THE APES screenplay. Going by Hunter's site,
> EPIC (which featured Breck and the first MacDonald) was dated 9/4/72 and
> BATTLE (which featured Kolp and the second MacDonald) was dated 12/29/72.
> But there had to be one in between because the Marvel adaptation (which
> was based on a screenplay supplied by Fox) featured the same story we see
> in the filmed version of BATTLE but with Breck instead of Kolp. So at
> what point was a fifth film decided on, and then when/why were Breck and
> the first MacDonald written out?

I believe they were written out (and please correct if I am wrong) because Don Murray and Hari Rhodes were unavailable. There is an article in the Battle Herald (available on the group website: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/Misc./Stuff/Battle.htm) about the casting of Austin Stoker which according to the article was very last minute.
>
> As an aside, does anyone remember if the MacDonald in Marvel's BATTLE
> adaptation was the brother (like in BATTLE) or the same person from
> CONQUEST (like in EPIC)?

The MacDonald in the Marvel adaption is supposed to be the same character as in Conquest.

>
>
> Ultimately it was interesting to see the original version, but I'm
> probably always going to think of it as a work in progress as opposed to
> the *actual* version of CONQUEST.
>
>
> Chris L.

I wonder which version most fans will now consider canon. Most fans now consider the extended version of Battle as the official version of that film. I wonder if the same will be true of Conquest.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2008 at 4:16 PM, rassmguy <handleyr@...> wrote:

LOL! Thanks, Bill. I just hope you're still that enthusiastic after
receiving it. :)

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Hollweg" <billhollweg@...> wrote:
>
> THIS is gonna be a GREAT CHRISTMAS!!!
>
> --
> Bill Hollweg
> Have Sword...
> Will Slay...
> Barbarian in need of Ale...
> Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
> Bill Hollweg
> Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
> www.brokensea.net
> The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
> Planet of the Apes at
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
> http://www.brokensea.com and
> CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
> http://brokensea.com/conan/
>

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

>When's the new Simian Scrolls due out?

On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Dave B <smugster2000@...> wrote:

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Hollweg" <billhollweg@...> wrote:

>When's the new Simian Scrolls due out?

Hmmmmmmmmm...

Right...about...NOW!

Crossing the pond as we speak - stay tuned!

Dave B

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

>Posted by: "Stuart Drucker" sdrucker@... stuartdruc
>I just got my copy yesterday, and I'd say that Rich did an impressive job
>knitting together all the different stories across the various sources, and
>even tied in potential plotlines that were under consideration but never
>made it into publication (such as "The Believer" in the Revolution series).
>Way to go! If only Empire of the Planet of the Apes had gotten published, we
>really could have fleshed out the post-Battle TL. There's definitely
>something for everyone in his book, even the most jaded POTA fan.

>Posted by: "softparadeband" softparadeband@... softparadeband
>I wish more fans would realize that the APES films were never produced
>with a pre-conceived timeline in mind. They were made one at a time,
>dictated by the sucess of the previous entry, and as they were
>greenlighted by the studio, screenwriters like Paul Dehn were trying to
>cobble together a coherent explaination to tie the overall story points
>together. Thus all the gaps and inconsistancies. I doubt it will ever
>become one long linear timeline without twisting, revamping and
>revisionist theorizing--JR

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Chris Lawless <lawford42@...> wrote:
>
> Some different thoughts that came to mind while watching the
original cut
> of CONQUEST, presented here in simple, bullet point form because
I'm too
> lazy to put them all into a cohesive paragraph...
>
>
> * Probably the most noticeable thing (to me, anyway) is the lack of
> pacing in the third act of the original version. The consensus
seems to
> be that it was never intended to be the final edit, but the version
that
> ultimately came out is much more polished and has a better flow to
the
> story. Most notably during the revolt. In the theatrical version,
you get
> the impression that the apes were systematically working through the
> city, section by section, towards the Command Post and there was a
clear
> sense of tension being built. In the original cut, it felt more like
> shootout, ambush, shootout, ambush, ambush, riot, then BOOM- they're
> cutting the door down.
>
>
> * Speaking of which, the background crowd noise during the scenes
where
> 1) Ape Management is being attacked, and 2) the apes are attacking
the
> police, is pretty thin. You'd expect a lot more noise from people
being
> knifed and beaten to death as well as the apes doing the knifing and
> beating.
>
>
> * Much as I enjoyed Tom Scott's score, I'm beginning to see why they
> opted for silence during a lot of the scenes. One thing that struck
me
> repeatedly was that 60's sounding mutated organ loop that you heard
as
> the command post was near to being attacked and the door cut
through.
> While effective in it's own right, it really didn't work there.
>
>
> * One thing that's PAINFULLY missing from the original cut is that
great
> final long shot of Caesar standing at the top of the stairs with
the apes
> screaming and jumping below him, MacDonald off to the right, and
all the
> buildings burning in the background. You do still see this shot in
the
> original version, but the final shot here is the slow close-up to
> Caesar's face/quick cut to black. Weird that the credits don't
start from
> the bottom of the screen either but rather they fade in already
scrolling
> halfway to the top.
>
>
> * Noticeable edits (now that I know what was originally there):
>
> - the cut after the gorilla jumps on the guy with the flamethrower
>
> - "Just massacre the lot!!" after "Well don't plead with them you
idiot!"
>
> - during the final scene outside, there's a much longer pause
between the
> two times MacDonald calls Caesar's name in the original version
than in
> the one we know. Right before he starts with "This was not how it
was to
> be".
>
>
> * As far as the repeated face shooting goes, the scene that struck
me the
> most was the one in the command post where Breck shoots a gorilla
point
> blank in the face. To me, that was pure 70's violence exploitation
> cinema. It was just SO over the top, even down to the fear reaction
in
> the gorilla's face and his (almost) shaking his head no, pleading
with
> Breck. Then a close up to the gun, Breck goes out of focus, and
BLAM!! If
> you get right down to it, the gorilla shouldn't have even known
what a
> gun was. The entire scene was both gratuitous and unnecessary.
>
> BTW, a split second of the first chimp getting shot in the face
still
> remains in the theatrical version. I never noticed it before until-
> again- I knew what was there originally.
>
>
> I also looked at the oft discussed scene from the theatrical version
> where the blood spurts out from the one guards face/head. I'm about
100%
> sure it's because the chimp hit him in the face with a rifle butt.
There
> were gunshots going on in the background, and one happened to
coincide
> with the guards head jerking. Otherwise, why make a point of
showing the
> chimp hit him in the face in the first place.
>
>
> From my comments yesterday:
>
> >>During the scenes where the apes are gathering their weapons in
that
> underground storage room, Lou Wagner's Busboy character is the one
> sorting everything and putting it all in (what appears to be) an oil
> drum... So at least there's some
> evidence intact of his original role in the film. Unless his
character
> only appears in the original cut of CONQUEST and that's why I never
> noticed him there before. I'll have to dig out a DVD and check. <<
>
> It's in both versions. I just never noticed before.
>
>
> >> Ditto for the scene after Caesar find out about Armando and he's
> looking at the flyer posted in the one storefront window. I
remember him
> putting his finger up to the poster, but not tapping on the glass. A
> minor point, obviously, but if the scene is different between the
two
> films then someone had to make a conscious decision to change it. <<
>
> Again, both versions, I just didn't remember that part.
>
>
> >>I also never remembered the scene where- after the first armed
attack
> on the apes (where the one chimp gets shot in the face) you see the
> guards callously laughing afterwards. Again, this could be unique
to the
> original cut. <<
>
> This was unique to the original cut. After the shooting, you see a
group
> shot of the guards reacting, but then they cut in a close up of them
> callously laughing afterwards. More from that same close-up shot is
seen
> shortly thereafter (in both versions) when the group lead by Caesar
is
> approaching and they just start looking at each other with a "Here
we go
> again" attitude.
>
>
> * Breck getting beaten to death brings up an old discussion which-
to my
> knowledge- has never been resolved. In the original version he
dies, but
> in the reedited version he lives. When the Corrington's are writing
their
> treatment for what was then called EPIC OF THE PLANET OF THE APES,
both
> Breck and the MacDonald from CONQUEST are in it. But a little more
than
> three months later, it's Kolp and the second MacDonald with two
lines
> from Kolp explaining the changes ("If the bomb hadn't killed the old
> Governor..." and "The black man in the brother of my predecessors'
> personal assistant...") although the first MacDonald's absence is
never
> fully explained.
>
> Presumably when CONQUEST was being filmed there were no definite
plans
> for a fifth film, and certainly not to have the character of Breck
> continue on. So after the film gets changed to what we know as the
> theatrical version, Breck was still a viable character and was used
in
> the EPIC OF THE PLANET OF THE APES screenplay. Going by Hunter's
site,
> EPIC (which featured Breck and the first MacDonald) was dated
9/4/72 and
> BATTLE (which featured Kolp and the second MacDonald) was dated
12/29/72.
> But there had to be one in between because the Marvel adaptation
(which
> was based on a screenplay supplied by Fox) featured the same story
we see
> in the filmed version of BATTLE but with Breck instead of Kolp. So
at
> what point was a fifth film decided on, and then when/why were
Breck and
> the first MacDonald written out?
>
> As an aside, does anyone remember if the MacDonald in Marvel's
BATTLE
> adaptation was the brother (like in BATTLE) or the same person from
> CONQUEST (like in EPIC)? Also, it occurs to me that the original
version
> of CONQUEST would essentially negate the entire story told in
REVOLUTION,
> although (in my opinion, anyway) Breck's claiming to have created
the
> Alpha-Omega bomb already puts that out of continuity because Taylor
(who
> had left Earth almost 20 years prior) already knew about the bomb,
and in
> the early 70's (or late 60's when you really think about it)
there's no
> logical way that Breck's character could have done that. Figuring
him to
> be in his 40's at the time of CONQUEST, he would have still been in
> college when Taylor left Earth.
>
>
> Ultimately it was interesting to see the original version, but I'm
> probably always going to think of it as a work in progress as
opposed to
> the *actual* version of CONQUEST.
>
>
> Chris L.
>

> Even though I'm bursting to see this version, things are done for a
> reason. Look at the DVD version of Donner's Superman II. Sucks.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "softparadeband" <softparadeband@...> wrote:
>
> I wish more fans would realize that the APES films were never produced
> with a pre-conceived timeline in mind. They were made one at a time,
> dictated by the sucess of the previous entry, and as they were
> greenlighted by the studio, screenwriters like Paul Dehn were trying to
> cobble together a coherent explaination to tie the overall story points
> together. Thus all the gaps and inconsistancies. I doubt it will ever
> become one long linear timeline without twisting, revamping and
> revisionist theorizing--JR
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Rawlings" <troyyortus@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone know the exact time interval for the layer transistion(s)
> on the two discs in the Return to the Planet of the Apes DVD set?
> Usually I can tell because my DVD player will flip from the "play"
sign
> to the "pause" sign and then back again for a second or two, but when
I
> was watching the "Tunnel of Fear" episode on Disc 1, about halfway
> through, there was a pause in the image but no flip in the signs. Just
> want to make sure the disc isn't defective.
>
> There is no noticeable pause anywhere on Disc 2.
>
>
> Thanks in advance for any assistance.
>
> Troy
>

--- On Wed, 12/3/08, jose ramon <joseramonruizdiez@...> wrote:

> From: jose ramon <joseramonruizdiez@...>
> Subject: Re: [pota] Apes Opera
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 11:11 AM
> http://intermezzo.typepad.com/intermezzo/2007/07/rigoletto-in-mu.html"
>
> JR
>
> --- On Wed, 12/3/08, Tim "apefan"
> <apefan23@...> wrote:
>
> From: Tim "apefan" <apefan23@...>
> Subject: [pota] Apes Opera
> To: "POTA" <pota@yahoogroups.com>,
> "POTA DG" <PotaDG@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 8:06 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Anyone remember a couple of years ago there were some pics
> floating around of a production of "rigoletto"
> done in bavaria and it seemed to be set on the Planet of the
> Apes? Does anyone have any of those pics? I did a google
> search and can only find one small one....
> I'd appreciate it!
> Tim

--- On Wed, 12/3/08, branchbrood <branchbrood@...> wrote:

> From: branchbrood <branchbrood@...>
> Subject: [pota] False Alarm and Ape Feet
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 6:39 PM
> Well I'll be a Monkey's Uncle.. It would appear I
> was a lil' hastey
> in screaming that I couldn't find my Posting I just
> needed to give
> our talented Mods the chance to get the blasted thing on
> the
> site...sorry.
> Well now I still have this burning Question, What happened
> to the Ape-
> Like Toe that was simulated on ALL the Simian Boot/Shoes in
> the First
> Three and Last Films? I mean in "Conquest" Ceasar
> & Co. are wearing
> nuthin more than these Canvas Slip on Deck Shoes(I've
> got the same
> kind in Black $5.99 "Shop Smart Shop S-Mart" lol)
> Anyhoo,It's not
> that I have a foot fetish see,It's just things like
> this Bug me! Like
> the good folks over at Paramount with the Star Trek
> Franchise,I mean
> nobodys ever tried to explain why All Klingons after 1979
> have that
> Brine Shrimp running up their foreheads!?! I mean WHAT
> HAPPENED to
> the ol' Swarmy lookin' Dudes!?! But I Digress lol
> I'm just wondering
> about this I'm thinking, to expand upon the
> comparrasions between the
> Human/Ape Society of "Conquest" and Race
> relations at the Time of the
> Films release in Real Life, Perhaps Govenor Breck had
> "Ape
> Management" Chop the Toe off all apes being
> Conditioned to keep them
> from Climbing away al'a Kuta Ken-Ty in
> "Roots"? I dunno. Oh speakin'
> of Ape/Human Politics, I just wanted to say To Mr. Greene I
> had
> always wanted your Book Since I first seen you on the AMC
> "Behind The
> POTA" the ONLY copy I'd ever found was about $50
> online. THEN a few
> weeks ago I go to a Book Sale at a Public Library here in
> Florida and
> Like Discovering the Ark Of The Covenent I found your Book
> for only
> $2.00!! I hate to be Cheap but I got three little Mutants
> to take
> care of and one Nova that = $$$ lol Anyhoo it's got
> that hard Boring
> Library Binding on it I wondered what the Original cover
> looked like?
> Well I'll leave you folks to ponder these Questions and
> debate what
> drugs I might be on lol But Thanks for your time
> Best,
> John B.

>
> A hollywood screenwriter friend of mine texted me this morning to say
> that Fox has greenlit this project.
>
> Prepare for Planet of the Apes: Genesis.
>
> For more:
>
> http://chud.com/articles/articles/16881/1/IS-PLANET-OF-THE-APES-

>
> You heard it from Mark first. Jump up and down and scream!!!!!
>
> X
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> Screenwriters are very low on the totem pole.
> They also think they should be welcome on the
> set. Often they are not. It's not right. Just how it is.
>
>
> In a message dated 12/3/2008 4:09:49 P.M. Central Standard Time,
> sparkytb@... writes:
>
> A hollywood screenwriter friend of mine texted me this morning to
say
> that Fox has greenlit this project.
>
>
> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email,
and
> favorite sites in one place. Try it now.
> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-
dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010)
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Dave B" <smugster2000@...> wrote:
> Whilst reading, I was undecided if this was the work of a
> genius or a maniac… So I decided to settle for it being
> the work of a maniacal genius.

Then I'd say you were spot on--I am, in fact, a maniacal genius.

> If you're the kind of person who complains that books
> are too long then you're probably a reader of Stephen
> King, if not, then be warned - this is HUGE. I guess
> any book that covers so many years of imaginary history
> has to be.

I did wonder if I'd made it too long, yeah. I hope it wasn't
distractingly so.

> Be assured that with very few exceptions there's nothing
> here that shouldn't be. One might question the validity
> of including references to swimming coaches and bicycle
> thieves but when such occurrences account for a tiny,
> almost infinitesimal fraction of the overall text…it's
> no biggie.

LOL--yeah, I knew those would raise some eyebrows. I kept them in to
be consistent with the "everything goes" approach I took to the book.

> Just as the actors personalities managed to `bleed through'
> John Chambers incredible make up, author, Rich's personality
> bleeds through every word, sentence and paragraph.

I couldn't ask for a more complimentary analogy. Thanks, man! (Of
course, that means if someone thinks my personality stinks, they
should probably buy that Steven King novel instead.)

> This book is a celebration, an unashamed love-letter
> and an invitation to share in his passion and enthusiasm
> for Planet of the Apes. The distance between his approach
> and that of someone delivering a dry lecture to an
> audience that doesn't really care is about as wide as
> the universe he has chosen to explore.

{{{humbled}}}

> Different readers, depending upon their perspective,
> will enjoy some sections of the book more than others -

Definitely. I keep waiting for the hate mail to arrive regarding the
Burton film entries. :)

> If I put my hand on my heart and reveal that he somehow
> manages to make even the events surrounding Tim Burton's
> re-imagining sound interesting then that might give you a
> good idea of what to expect.

Woo-hooo! Then my work here is done. (Well, not really...I've
already begun the next book.)

> A truly stunning cover wrapped around a clear, eye-
> pleasing layout, Timeline of the Planet of the Apes:
> The Definitive Chronology, proves once again that
> anything of worth in the future of the APES franchise
> is in the hands of its fans.

Great--so, to whom did you say I should make that check out again?

> THE BAD

Bad??? My book has no bad!!! It-- oh, um, never mind.

> For obvious reasons the use of images is somewhat limited.
> What images there are, are functional but aren't likely
> to rock your world –

Sad, but true. We were worried about copyright infringement, so we
stuck to the covers. And there are a ton of covers used...but they're
still just covers, nonetheless. I hope we made good use of them. We
may be a bit more risk-taking with the next book, in terms of pictures.

> My advice; read this and at the same time marvel at the
> images in that free book given away with the new Blu Rays!

A sensible approach! And listen to the soundtracks while you're doing so.

> THE UGLY
> There's no picture of the author anywhere – I therefore
> conclude that Rich Handley is very ugly :0)

Damn you, Ballard--damn you all to hell!

>
> Hey Troy,
> I know the pause when the layer changes on DVD's that you are

> about but I don't have any of this on my Return DVD's. Sounds like

> may have a bad disc.
> John
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Rawlings" <troyyortus@> wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone know the exact time interval for the layer transistion

> > on the two discs in the Return to the Planet of the Apes DVD set?
> > Usually I can tell because my DVD player will flip from

> sign
> > to the "pause" sign and then back again for a second or two, but

> I
> > was watching the "Tunnel of Fear" episode on Disc 1, about

> > through, there was a pause in the image but no flip in the signs.

> > want to make sure the disc isn't defective.
> >
> > There is no noticeable pause anywhere on Disc 2.
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance for any assistance.
> >
> > Troy
> >
>

----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Lawless <lawford42@...>
Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008 1:54 am
Subject: [pota] a Power (Records) trip

> So this past Saturday, I took my yearly jaunt down to Philadelphia
> to a
> music expo. Aside from the scenery, the three hour trip allows for
> a good
> stretch of music listening, but I opted to bring a long a recent eBay
> purchase of the 8 Power Records POTA stories (on one disc) and
> give them
> a listen as I hadn't heard the first four in years and- in fact- had
> never heard the four TV series stories. To this day, I remain
> impressedwith how well the four movies were adapted. Compressing
> movies that run
> from anywhere between 90-120 minutes down to just 12 would lead
> one to
> believe that there would be major gaps in the storytelling, but in
> factthe four of them hit all the key elements from the respective
> films. And
> the changes that are made i.e. removing Zaius from BENEATH, or
> Corneliusfrom BATTLE, isn't even noticeable as far as the story is
> concerned.Interesting though with both those versions that the
> characters of Zaius
> and Cornelius apper of the respective front covers. Other minor
> changes-
> like Brent falling through the ground in the Forbidden Zone and
> discovering that he's back on Earth and Mendez activating the bomb-
> don't
> detract from the story in the slightest. I will say though that
> the cover
> for BENEATH still has the strangest interpretation of the Alpha Omega
> bomb I've seen.
>
> One minor gripe about ESCAPE: Zira saying "Wheee!! What luxury!!"
> Just a
> tad bit out of character there...
>
> One thing that came to mind when listening to BATTLE (which I didn't
> actually own when I was small and only heard once before) is that
> you get
> the impression that the source material for that adaptation is as
> epic as
> the source material for, say, PLANET. What I mean that when you
> comparehow the adaptations stack up to the films, the Power BATTLE
> is as good as
> the Power PLANET (or BENEATH and ESCAPE for that matter). In that
> sense,BATTLE comes across as a lot more substantive that it's
> given credit for.
> And I'm not trashing the film, because I've certainly said before
here
> that I really do enjoy it. I'm certainly aware of it's
> shortcomings, but
> that doesn't stop me from enjoying it though.
>
> There's also one line in particular that seemed to address a
> noticeableproblem in BATTLE: the rather small army that attacked
> Ape City. Here,
> the narrator says "An army that would be pathetic were it not for
it's
> deadly intent sets out across the desert" and that almost
> validates the
> problem from the source material because you've addressed what comes
> across as the obvious problem but at the same time qualified the
> mutantarmy as an actual threat. Interesting how that was done.
>
> The TV series stories were all well done, and in fact there seemed
> to be
> a deliberate (and obviously, necessary) attempt to completely
> convey the
> story with the audio track because there was no accompanying book.
For
> example, if you hadn't seen the book for BATTLE, I don't know if
you'd
> realize that Kolp was using a flamethrower at one point. The only
> thingthat made me wince a bit was the need to work all four story
> titles into
> the dialog at one point:
>
> "And this is the very mysterious MOUNTAIN OF THE DELPHI."
>
> "It's the BATTLE OF TWO WORLDS, alright."
>
> "How can we pass up the chance to see something as beautiful as a
> sunrise? The new DAWN OF THE TREE PEOPLE".
>
> "Unlike the humans of 2000 years ago, I believe my fellow apes
> will see
> the precipice ahead and pull back in time. I think they will learn
the
> lesson of the VOLCANO."
>
> Yeesh.
>
> The only thing that struck me weird was how in MOUNTAIN OF THE
DELPHI,
> Virdon says that he and Pete come from another planet called Earth
> yet at
> the end of the story are aware that they're on Earth. I had
> thought for a
> second that discovering the Liberty Bell was going to be their
> Statute of
> Liberty/Queensborough Plaza moment, but by the end of the story I
> got the
> impression that they already knew where they were. There also
> seemed to
> be a deliberate nod to the TV series inasmuch as between Virdon
> and Burke
> that had experience in just about every job and craft imaginable.
> In DAWN
> OF THE TREE PEOPLE, Virdon adds alligator wrestling to his resume.
>
> Nice touch: the voice actors for Brent and Taylor doing the voices
for
> Virdon and Burke, respectively.
>
> All in all, it was a pleasant distraction that ate up a good chunk of
> travel time. It also got me thinking that it'd be an interesting fan
> project to try and do a book and record adaptation of CONQUEST in the
> same manner as the other four films were done. Sounds effects, needle
> drop music, and 12 minutes long. For the sake of simplicity, we could
> make the audio an MP3 as opposed to getting a 7" vinyl disc pressed.
>
> Just a thought...
>
>
> Chris L.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Chris Lawless <lawford42@...> wrote:
>
> So this past Saturday, I took my yearly jaunt down to Philadelphia to a
> music expo. Aside from the scenery, the three hour trip allows for a
good
> stretch of music listening, but I opted to bring a long a recent eBay
> purchase of the 8 Power Records POTA stories (on one disc) and give them
> a listen as I hadn't heard the first four in years and- in fact- had
> never heard the four TV series stories. To this day, I remain impressed
> with how well the four movies were adapted. Compressing movies that run
> from anywhere between 90-120 minutes down to just 12 would lead one to
> believe that there would be major gaps in the storytelling, but in fact
> the four of them hit all the key elements from the respective films. And
> the changes that are made i.e. removing Zaius from BENEATH, or Cornelius
> from BATTLE, isn't even noticeable as far as the story is concerned.
> Interesting though with both those versions that the characters of Zaius
> and Cornelius apper of the respective front covers. Other minor changes-
> like Brent falling through the ground in the Forbidden Zone and
> discovering that he's back on Earth and Mendez activating the bomb-
don't
> detract from the story in the slightest. I will say though that the
cover
> for BENEATH still has the strangest interpretation of the Alpha Omega
> bomb I've seen.
>
> One minor gripe about ESCAPE: Zira saying "Wheee!! What luxury!!" Just a
> tad bit out of character there...
>
> One thing that came to mind when listening to BATTLE (which I didn't
> actually own when I was small and only heard once before) is that
you get
> the impression that the source material for that adaptation is as
epic as
> the source material for, say, PLANET. What I mean that when you compare
> how the adaptations stack up to the films, the Power BATTLE is as
good as
> the Power PLANET (or BENEATH and ESCAPE for that matter). In that sense,
> BATTLE comes across as a lot more substantive that it's given credit
for.
> And I'm not trashing the film, because I've certainly said before here
> that I really do enjoy it. I'm certainly aware of it's shortcomings, but
> that doesn't stop me from enjoying it though.
>
> There's also one line in particular that seemed to address a noticeable
> problem in BATTLE: the rather small army that attacked Ape City. Here,
> the narrator says "An army that would be pathetic were it not for it's
> deadly intent sets out across the desert" and that almost validates the
> problem from the source material because you've addressed what comes
> across as the obvious problem but at the same time qualified the mutant
> army as an actual threat. Interesting how that was done.
>
> The TV series stories were all well done, and in fact there seemed to be
> a deliberate (and obviously, necessary) attempt to completely convey the
> story with the audio track because there was no accompanying book. For
> example, if you hadn't seen the book for BATTLE, I don't know if you'd
> realize that Kolp was using a flamethrower at one point. The only thing
> that made me wince a bit was the need to work all four story titles into
> the dialog at one point:
>
> "And this is the very mysterious MOUNTAIN OF THE DELPHI."
>
> "It's the BATTLE OF TWO WORLDS, alright."
>
> "How can we pass up the chance to see something as beautiful as a
> sunrise? The new DAWN OF THE TREE PEOPLE".
>
> "Unlike the humans of 2000 years ago, I believe my fellow apes will see
> the precipice ahead and pull back in time. I think they will learn the
> lesson of the VOLCANO."
>
> Yeesh.
>
> The only thing that struck me weird was how in MOUNTAIN OF THE DELPHI,
> Virdon says that he and Pete come from another planet called Earth
yet at
> the end of the story are aware that they're on Earth. I had thought
for a
> second that discovering the Liberty Bell was going to be their
Statute of
> Liberty/Queensborough Plaza moment, but by the end of the story I
got the
> impression that they already knew where they were. There also seemed to
> be a deliberate nod to the TV series inasmuch as between Virdon and
Burke
> that had experience in just about every job and craft imaginable. In
DAWN
> OF THE TREE PEOPLE, Virdon adds alligator wrestling to his resume.
>
> Nice touch: the voice actors for Brent and Taylor doing the voices for
> Virdon and Burke, respectively.
>
> All in all, it was a pleasant distraction that ate up a good chunk of
> travel time. It also got me thinking that it'd be an interesting fan
> project to try and do a book and record adaptation of CONQUEST in the
> same manner as the other four films were done. Sounds effects, needle
> drop music, and 12 minutes long. For the sake of simplicity, we could
> make the audio an MP3 as opposed to getting a 7" vinyl disc pressed.
>
> Just a thought...
>
>
> Chris L.
>

> Definitely. I keep waiting for the hate mail to arrive regarding the
> Burton film entries. :)

> > THE UGLY
> > There's no picture of the author anywhere – I therefore
> > conclude that Rich Handley is very ugly :0)

> Damn you, Ballard--damn you all to hell!

> Thanks for the great overview of the entire series. Very insightful
> and another POV that supports the high quality put into these records
> despite being targeted for kids.

> I have most of the records, but never really gave them a good listen
> although I've been wanting to do that for a long time. I too have
> always wanted to put them all together for a good listen during a long
> trip, but you beat me to it.

> > Definitely. I keep waiting for the hate mail to arrive regarding the
> > Burton film entries. :)
>I decided to keep my mouth shut and just ignore those.... ;-)

> > > THE UGLY
> > > There's no picture of the author anywhere ­ I therefore
> > > conclude that Rich Handley is very ugly :0)
> > Damn you, Ballard--damn you all to hell!
>I had looked for the photo, too. However, since it was missing, I had
>assumed he was on the lam or something....

> My photo is on the cover--I'm the guy pleasuring the Alpha-Omega Bomb.

>
> Essentially... what discrepancies does the Director's Cut 'CONQUEST'
> create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
>
> .

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "apecalypsenow" <apecalypsenow@...> wrote:
>
> Essentially... what discrepancies does the Director's Cut 'CONQUEST'
> create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
>
> Thanks...
>
>
> Tiziano Caliendo.
>

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 10:58 AM, Scott Raile <raile@...> wrote:

apecalypsenow wrote:
>
> Essentially... what discrepancies does the Director's Cut 'CONQUEST'
> create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
>

> .

The one discontinuity that I noticed was that, in the Director's Cut,
it's pretty obvious that the gorillas beat Breck to death. But in
BATTLE, there's some sort of dialogue between Caesar and McDonald that
references Breck's survival (sorry I can't be more precise; I'm at work
now without a Blu-Ray player!).

Speaking of McDonald, does anyone know why they bothered to mention that
the McDonald in CONQUEST was the brother of the one in BATTLE? I know
it's a different actor, but what would have been the problem of having
another actor play the same character? It just seems like sort of a
superfluous remark to excuse the fact that it's a different guy;
distracting for no real purpose.

Scott

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 11:48 AM, Bill Hollweg <billhollweg@...> wrote:

I think the reference to the Brother of McDonald was to show some passage of time, I am at work as well and going off memory here-LOL

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 10:58 AM, Scott Raile <raile@...> wrote:

apecalypsenow wrote:
>
> Essentially... what discrepancies does the Director's Cut 'CONQUEST'
> create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
>

> .

The one discontinuity that I noticed was that, in the Director's Cut,
it's pretty obvious that the gorillas beat Breck to death. But in
BATTLE, there's some sort of dialogue between Caesar and McDonald that
references Breck's survival (sorry I can't be more precise; I'm at work
now without a Blu-Ray player!).

Speaking of McDonald, does anyone know why they bothered to mention that
the McDonald in CONQUEST was the brother of the one in BATTLE? I know
it's a different actor, but what would have been the problem of having
another actor play the same character? It just seems like sort of a
superfluous remark to excuse the fact that it's a different guy;
distracting for no real purpose.

Scott

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

--
Bill Hollweg
Have Sword...
    Will Slay...
       Barbarian in need of Ale...
Check out my fantasy Audio Drama-
Bill Hollweg
Lord of Design for BrokenSea Audio
www.brokensea.net
The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://www.brokensea.com and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes at
http://www.brokensea.com and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://www.brokensea.com and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://brokensea.com/conan/

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@...> wrote:
>
> Having Governor Breck killed goes against the line of dialog in BATTLE
that mentions he died from the bomb. Now, I suppose it might MIGHT
be possible he survived the pummeling at the end of the "director's
cut", perhaps as a veggie, but I doubt it. Then again, it's no worse
than Taylor's ship being used by the apes, , hell, even Nova actually
remembering how to go across the wasteland to Ape city like she's done
it numerous times. Not to mention how she knew where Cornelius &
Zira lived. But hell, that's entertainment.
> - Scott
>
> --- On Thu, 12/4/08, apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@... wrote:
>
> From: apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@...
> Subject: [pota] Director's Cut CONQUEST: new "continuity"?
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 10:11 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Essentially. .. what discrepancies does the Director's Cut 'CONQUEST'
> create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
>
> Thanks...
>
> Tiziano Caliendo.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "James" <JamesA1102@...> wrote:
>
> Or Kolp may have just assumed that Breck was killed by the bomb.
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@> wrote:
> >
> > Having Governor Breck killed goes against the line of dialog in
BATTLE
> that mentions he died from the bomb. Now, I suppose it might MIGHT
> be possible he survived the pummeling at the end of the "director's
> cut", perhaps as a veggie, but I doubt it. Then again, it's no
worse
> than Taylor's ship being used by the apes, , hell, even Nova
actually
> remembering how to go across the wasteland to Ape city like she's
done
> it numerous times. Not to mention how she knew where Cornelius &
> Zira lived. But hell, that's entertainment.
> > - Scott
> >
> > --- On Thu, 12/4/08, apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@ wrote:
> >
> > From: apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@
> > Subject: [pota] Director's Cut CONQUEST: new "continuity"?
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 10:11 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Essentially. .. what discrepancies does the Director's
Cut 'CONQUEST'
> > create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
> >
> > Thanks...
> >
> > Tiziano Caliendo.
> >
>

> There's no picture of the author anywhere –I therefore conclude that
> Rich Handley is very ugly :0)
>
> Dave B

>
> I'm sure the shoe change was merely a budget thing....The slippers

>
>
> --- On Wed, 12/3/08, branchbrood <branchbrood@...> wrote:
>
> > From: branchbrood <branchbrood@...>
> > Subject: [pota] False Alarm and Ape Feet
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 6:39 PM
> > Well I'll be a Monkey's Uncle.. It would appear I
> > was a lil' hastey
> > in screaming that I couldn't find my Posting I just
> > needed to give
> > our talented Mods the chance to get the blasted thing on
> > the
> > site...sorry.
> > Well now I still have this burning Question, What happened
> > to the Ape-
> > Like Toe that was simulated on ALL the Simian Boot/Shoes in
> > the First
> > Three and Last Films? I mean in "Conquest" Ceasar
> > & Co. are wearing
> > nuthin more than these Canvas Slip on Deck Shoes(I've
> > got the same
> > kind in Black $5.99 "Shop Smart Shop S-Mart" lol)
> > Anyhoo,It's not
> > that I have a foot fetish see,It's just things like
> > this Bug me! Like
> > the good folks over at Paramount with the Star Trek
> > Franchise,I mean
> > nobodys ever tried to explain why All Klingons after 1979
> > have that
> > Brine Shrimp running up their foreheads!?! I mean WHAT
> > HAPPENED to
> > the ol' Swarmy lookin' Dudes!?! But I Digress lol
> > I'm just wondering
> > about this I'm thinking, to expand upon the
> > comparrasions between the
> > Human/Ape Society of "Conquest" and Race
> > relations at the Time of the
> > Films release in Real Life, Perhaps Govenor Breck had
> > "Ape
> > Management" Chop the Toe off all apes being
> > Conditioned to keep them
> > from Climbing away al'a Kuta Ken-Ty in
> > "Roots"? I dunno. Oh speakin'
> > of Ape/Human Politics, I just wanted to say To Mr. Greene I
> > had
> > always wanted your Book Since I first seen you on the AMC
> > "Behind The
> > POTA" the ONLY copy I'd ever found was about $50
> > online. THEN a few
> > weeks ago I go to a Book Sale at a Public Library here in
> > Florida and
> > Like Discovering the Ark Of The Covenent I found your Book
> > for only
> > $2.00!! I hate to be Cheap but I got three little Mutants
> > to take
> > care of and one Nova that = $$$ lol Anyhoo it's got
> > that hard Boring
> > Library Binding on it I wondered what the Original cover
> > looked like?
> > Well I'll leave you folks to ponder these Questions and
> > debate what
> > drugs I might be on lol But Thanks for your time
> > Best,
> > John B.
>

>
> Or Kolp may have just assumed that Breck was killed by the bomb.
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@> wrote:
> >
> > Having Governor Breck killed goes against the line of dialog in

> that mentions he died from the bomb. Now, I suppose it might MIGHT
> be possible he survived the pummeling at the end of the "director's
> cut", perhaps as a veggie, but I doubt it. Then again, it's no

> than Taylor's ship being used by the apes, , hell, even Nova

> remembering how to go across the wasteland to Ape city like she's

> it numerous times. Not to mention how she knew where Cornelius &
> Zira lived. But hell, that's entertainment.
> > - Scott
> >
> > --- On Thu, 12/4/08, apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@ wrote:
> >
> > From: apecalypsenow apecalypsenow@
> > Subject: [pota] Director's Cut CONQUEST: new "continuity"?
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 10:11 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Essentially. .. what discrepancies does the Director's

> > create? What differences plot-wise? I'm puzzled.
> >
> > Thanks...
> >
> > Tiziano Caliendo.
> >
>Or How Brent knew Nova's Name WAS NOVA!?! or hee heee What happened

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "ronnie2467" <ronnie2467@...> wrote:
>
> The article I read from the new google alert noted that the new apes
> saga will deal with the 1000 year time period between 2009 till I
take
> it the lawgivers speech in battle,am I right about this? There is so
> much gap that thay can make a prequel like star wars.I bet thay are
> going to do a prequel of the new star trek movie also.
> I wonder at what time peroid this movie will start out?
>

Brent heard Cornelius and Zira call her Nova.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "branchbrood" <branchbrood@...> wrote:
>
> >Or How Brent knew Nova's Name WAS NOVA!?! or hee heee What happened
> to the Apes' Extra Toe? just Kidding on the toe thing
> John
>