.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Alexander Ruiz

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 7:48 PM

Subject: [pota] New intro to prophecysite

I've just made a new intro to my site:

www.prophecysite.com

 

I hope it's not too over the top, but I just wanted to make a better intro to both the Classic and Revisit Site.

 

I know Jeff would be glad to hear this.

 

All the best,

Alex

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.htmlIn a message dated 5/26/01 7:29:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

That sculpture is gorgeous, but I think Scott said he bought it for him.
Also, last time I was there John left his Oscar and Emmy on the desk where
someone could snag it. He says sometimes he even uses it as a doorstop. The
only POTA Oscar in existence (until next year)!      - - - - Jeff K.

I'd love to see the Oscar footage of him getting that thing handed to him by
the chimp and Walter Matthau.

-- Rory<.html

They showed "Stairway to Heaven" at the Motion Picture Academy about a year
ago but I didn't learn about it until it was too
- - - - Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: <LordTZer0@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 8:07 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] Recommend some Ape-Related Movies


>
>
> Well, as far as Kim Hunter films are concerned
> Streetcar probably turns up the most on television for obvious reasons.
The
> ones besides it that show up the most are her first film the
suspense/horror
> classic
> The Seventh Victim and
> Deadline USA a Humphrey Bogart noir.
>
> Once in a while you might find the only antiwar film ever made during
W.W.II,
> Tender Comrade, an ironic title considering her later blacklisting. And
> Lilith, A psychological Warren Beatty flick and
> She makes brief appearances in
> The Swimmer with Burt Lancaster.
> The Kindred with Rod Steiger
> Two Evil Eyes with Harvey Keitel &
> Midnight In The Garden of Good And Evil
> And her performance in
> Dark August is the only good thing about it.
>
> Her TV movies include . . .
> Bad Ronald &
> Born Innocent with Linda Blair
> as well as many television series guest spots
>
> One of her best films isn't on much. The Archer's classic . . .
> Stairway To Heaven aka A Matter Of Life And Death with David Niven.
>
> Betrayed aka When Strangers Marry is supposed to be a great noir with
Robert
> Mitchum, but it so rare I've never seen it and can't find a copy.
>
> The same with Anything Can Happen and You Came Along.
>
> Probably her most Apes related film is . . .
> The Young Stranger, with Apes co-stars James Gregory and James Daly.
> I managed to get a laser disk, but I don't have a player so I haven't seen
it
> either. Perhaps someday I can dub a tape.
>
>
>
>
>
>

.htmlIn a message dated 5/26/01 7:38:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

The "Beneath" ending was a consiracy between Heston and Richard Zanuck.
Apparently director Ted Post didn't know that until he saw the "Behind the
pOTA" documentary. He expressed his outrage that Heston would selfishly
champion that ending in "Apesfan" #2. Post hated that ending! (What happened
to the auteur theory?)         - - - Jeff K.

Yeah, I love that interview with Ted Post.  Post is no bullshitter, and
pretty much comes out and says Heston was (and surely still is) an egomaniac.
 Anyone ever hear Heston give one of his NRA speeches?  Wow!

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/26/01 7:38:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

The "Beneath" ending was a consiracy between Heston and Richard Zanuck.  
Post hated that ending! (What happened
to the auteur theory?)         - - - Jeff K.

BENEATH is very much a movie made by committee.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/26/01 7:48:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Looks great, Alex! Your time clock only has 2 more months to go!

                                                                     - - -
- Jeff K.


I went to "Pearl Harbor" today and finally saw the POTA trailer in a theatre
and with an audience.  The crowd was pretty silent, and I'm getting tired of
that trailer.

"Pearl Harbor" was only okay and was only that during the action.  The rest
of it was crap.  Somebody told me Ron Harper was in it, but I didn't see him.
 I was pleased to see Mako.  I just watched the DVD of "The Sand Pebbles" --
one of my favorite Fox films, and one of Jerry Goldsmith's best scores -- and
it was nice to see Mako still working.

-- Rory<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Kay53531@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 12:20 PM

Subject: [pota] PLANET OF APES SERIES MISSUNDERSTANDING

JANE CALLED ME PERSONALLY FROM FOX.SHE SAID THAT SHE MISSREAD HER BOSSES
EMAIL! THAT SAID NO SERIES AT ALL IN NOV.IT WAS NO VHS TAPES WILL BE RELEASED
THE DVDS NEVER CHANGED NOV 20TH IS STILL ON! SO THEY TOLD ME NO MORE LETTERS!
OR PHONE CALLS! GET THE FACTS STRAIGHT JANE YOU GAVE US ALL HEART ATTACKS!   
BRYAN              WE CAN ALL COOL DOWN  

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<.html

.html  

Jack Krueger wrote:

 Brian - - -   Let us know what you think after watching the show after 18 years!                                                                         - - - - Jeff K.

Hey Jeff,
That's the other Bryan, with a "y", not me.
Brian
 
 
 

----- Original Message -----

From: Kay53531@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 7:20 PM

Subject: [pota] MICHAEL WHITTY APE SERIES VIDEOS

 DEAR MICHAEL I HAVE 100.00 in travelers checks american express for 1 set
70.00 30.00 shipping .Sending thursday 25th. When were they released?Will you
send them mail or parcel ? Thank tou for your offer to do this for me ,its
been 18 years since i have seen the tv series! You should recieve money with
in 3to 5 days.Please email me when you ship them i will be watching for them
if i have to sign for package thanks , i will assist you if dvds become
available here. please email me let me know kay53531@...     BRYAN

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<.html

.html <.html

I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their favorite
film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?

Matt

.htmlI liked the battle for planet of apes scene were aldo goes against caesar the
tree climb ,you killed my son and the whole ape shall never kill ape! Bryan<.html

.htmlWhen Lost in space came out starlog did a whole collectors mag on the
film,Think they will do an apes edition ? June 13 next issue will be out.Also
scifi channel did the making of lost in space interviews and stuff,hope they
give new apes film same treatment. Bryan<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 4:48 PM

Subject: [pota] Favorite POTA moments.

Okay, how about this for a topic:  What are your favorite POTA moments?  What
are the scenes, or even lines from the films or TV show that you just can't
wait to see or hear again?

I'll start with these:

In PLANET:  The crash landing, the first appearence of the gorillas on
horseback, "Get your stinking paws off of me....," "You cut up his brain, you
bloody baboon," the Statue of Liberty.

BENEATH:  the Ursus' speech, Zaius saying, "Now enough of this nonsense," the
subway station, the mutants 'revealing' themselves.

ESCAPE:  The apes taking off their helmets (and Jerry Goldsmith's main title
music), Hasslein's expression when he hears Cornelius' "Only when she lets
me." joke,  Zira under the sodium pentothal, Baby Milo's first words.

CONQUEST:  Caesar washing his hands, the apes coming over the bridge to face
the police, the torch cutting through the door and its busting in, "Tonight
we have seen the birth of the planet of the apes!"

BATTLE:  The end credit roll (NO! Just kidding!).   The shot of the destroyed
city (better than anything in BENEATH).

The TV show:  It's been too long since I've seen it to say, BUT what about
the rest of you?

-- Rory

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.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Kay53531@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 9:24 PM

Subject: [pota] galen one cool ape

ITS BEEN 18 YEARS SINCE I SEEN THE SERIES BUT GALEN WAS COOL I WANTED AN APE
FRIEND TO HANG OUT WITH AT SCHOOL! THEY WERE GREAT TOGETHER> DOES ANYONE HAVE
A BIG APE COLLECTION! AND WHAT DOES EVERONE THINK IS THEIR MOST PRIZE ITEM!   
BRYAN

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<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Brian

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 6:23 PM

Subject: [pota] Lawgiver Artists

Bill Creber was in charge of the art department.  I do not know if he designed the original statue with his own drawings, but he did oversee every look of the film.  In those days, approved ART DEPT designs were shuffled off to the different studio departments; WOOD SHOP, PROP SHOP, FOAM SHOP, METAL SHOP, SCENICS, etc, etc, etc.   Chances are that a team of sculptors in the SCULPTURE shop worked on the Lawgiver from ape-proved designs, then the sculpture was handed over to the MOLD SHOP where stone or fiberglass molds were made of of it.

At least 2 full statues were pulled from those molds, one for location work, one for soundstages at the studio.

And at least one bust was made for use in the courtroom during Taylor's tribunal.  That bust was later fitted with blood tubes and oozed red paint during the hallucination scenes in Beneath. (rumor has it that the bust now resides in a basement in Florida) Blood drips were painted on one of the two full size statues for the long shots of the statue toppling over onto Zaius.

At the end of filming for Beneath, Jacobs gave one of the two full statues to Sammy Davis Jr., because he liked it so much.  That upset John Chambers, because Jacobs had already promissed it to him.  At some point the Candyman had it whitewashed while it sat in his back yard.  It is now owned by an actor in Studio City, California.  That's the one that we molded (for our replicas) and it has been completely restored to all it's original glory.

The other Lawgiver statue seen in many of the publicity fotos of Dr Zaius, (you know the shot of him that looks like he's in a dark room preaching in front of the statue?) was part of the Jacobs estate until sometime in late 1998 when Natalie Trundy auctioned it off.  Sadly it only fetched $15G's (I couldn't outbid the other guy once it reached 15.5, drat!!!)  but we wound up restoring it for the new owner anyway.  It was in pretty sad shape.  full of BB holes and such.  It now sits atop a hillside home in a private community in Orange County, Calif.   Actually a pretty majestic spot overlooking a state park area with hiking trails, so humans have to look up to the great one, and rightfully so!

The small desktop version of the statue  (seen in Zaius' office in the first film and Zira's house in Beneath) is owned by a special effects guy here in the San Fernando Valley, and it's very doubtfull anyone will ever see it again.  He keeps his collection pretty tightly wrapped.  I don't blame him.  He is contemplating making a limited edition avalable.  We'll see.

Too much information?  Sorry,  you got me going.

Brian
 
 

Haristas@... wrote:

In a message dated 05/24/2001 8:19:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
afryt4u@... writes:

<< Some of you may want to check out this iron-artist's ape work.  I found
 it's presentaion on the site a bit insulting.  What do you all think?

 <http://daily.chattanooga.com/mcpeek/index.htm>
 

 Brian >>

Well, I didn't think much of that.  The guy doesn't seem to have much talent.

Anyway, I was wondering...... Do you know who it was that sculpted the
original Lawgiver statue?   I would assume Bill Creber, but maybe not.

-- Rory
 
 

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Brian

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 6:23 PM

Subject: [pota] Lawgiver Artists

Bill Creber was in charge of the art department.  I do not know if he designed the original statue with his own drawings, but he did oversee every look of the film.  In those days, approved ART DEPT designs were shuffled off to the different studio departments; WOOD SHOP, PROP SHOP, FOAM SHOP, METAL SHOP, SCENICS, etc, etc, etc.   Chances are that a team of sculptors in the SCULPTURE shop worked on the Lawgiver from ape-proved designs, then the sculpture was handed over to the MOLD SHOP where stone or fiberglass molds were made of of it.

At least 2 full statues were pulled from those molds, one for location work, one for soundstages at the studio.

And at least one bust was made for use in the courtroom during Taylor's tribunal.  That bust was later fitted with blood tubes and oozed red paint during the hallucination scenes in Beneath. (rumor has it that the bust now resides in a basement in Florida) Blood drips were painted on one of the two full size statues for the long shots of the statue toppling over onto Zaius.

At the end of filming for Beneath, Jacobs gave one of the two full statues to Sammy Davis Jr., because he liked it so much.  That upset John Chambers, because Jacobs had already promissed it to him.  At some point the Candyman had it whitewashed while it sat in his back yard.  It is now owned by an actor in Studio City, California.  That's the one that we molded (for our replicas) and it has been completely restored to all it's original glory.

The other Lawgiver statue seen in many of the publicity fotos of Dr Zaius, (you know the shot of him that looks like he's in a dark room preaching in front of the statue?) was part of the Jacobs estate until sometime in late 1998 when Natalie Trundy auctioned it off.  Sadly it only fetched $15G's (I couldn't outbid the other guy once it reached 15.5, drat!!!)  but we wound up restoring it for the new owner anyway.  It was in pretty sad shape.  full of BB holes and such.  It now sits atop a hillside home in a private community in Orange County, Calif.   Actually a pretty majestic spot overlooking a state park area with hiking trails, so humans have to look up to the great one, and rightfully so!

The small desktop version of the statue  (seen in Zaius' office in the first film and Zira's house in Beneath) is owned by a special effects guy here in the San Fernando Valley, and it's very doubtfull anyone will ever see it again.  He keeps his collection pretty tightly wrapped.  I don't blame him.  He is contemplating making a limited edition avalable.  We'll see.

Too much information?  Sorry,  you got me going.

Brian
 
 

Haristas@... wrote:

In a message dated 05/24/2001 8:19:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
afryt4u@... writes:

<< Some of you may want to check out this iron-artist's ape work.  I found
 it's presentaion on the site a bit insulting.  What do you all think?

 <http://daily.chattanooga.com/mcpeek/index.htm>
 

 Brian >>

Well, I didn't think much of that.  The guy doesn't seem to have much talent.

Anyway, I was wondering...... Do you know who it was that sculpted the
original Lawgiver statue?   I would assume Bill Creber, but maybe not.

-- Rory
 
 

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<.html

Yes, I agree. That's why I said the Megos are my favorite, the nostalgia.
As a kid I think I had them for a grand total of a week before the string
holding them together broke (none of the adults told me you can retie the
string and save the figure). It wasn't until the '90's I found some again.
Couldn't afford them packaged, had to buy them loose but that's even better.
Medicoms are better to look at but Megos are fun to pose, etc. I was lucky
to get them while they were still kinda cheap. Now even the loose ones have
skyrocketed. The Burke one was on John Chambers' birthday cake I designed. I
also put a soldier ape on it but that got ripped off at the event. Burke
almost got ripped off (by an old lady no less) but I got him back, though in
the process he lost a moccassin. Now he has one bare foot, but he's proud
that he sacrificed the shoe for John, at least that's what he tells me. But,
you know Burke, he often kids around so maybe he resents it. I sure hope
not! - - - - Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: <MTotsky@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2001 8:18 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] Before There Were Medicoms


>
> In a message dated 5/24/01 7:11:25 PM, whitty@... writes:
>
> << I'm looking.....
>
> Still waiting to hear from Matt the reason you think the Megos are
> better....... >>
>
> I think you're thinking of someone else (Chad?) I never said Megos were
> better, but if you want my opinion here it is:
>
> Of course, the Medicoms are much more accurate and therefore better (they
are
> still not perfect figures, they need more articulation), but nothing will
> ever hold the sentimental place in my heart that the Mego Apes (and the
Mego
> Superheroes) do. I played with those endlessly as a kid and therefore they
> are better in that regard. I'm just glad my Mego Apes survived my
childhood
> relatively intact (I did have to replace some parts and figures - I wish I
> still had the Ape City playset).
>
> Make sense?
>
> Matt
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Ken & Heather Taylor

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, May 25, 2001 2:02 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Before There Were Medicoms

I see from your photos that you too perhaps love the old Universal Monsters,
Ken?   Is that so?

-- Rory

Yeah, at the time I was into pretty much all of famous monsters of filmland.
In particular, I loved Frankenstein and Dracula. For a while, I use to collect any dolls or figures of these characters but when I started focussing on my APES collection, they kind of took a back seat. The reason I had the Mego Frank was because at the time I had most of the Megos that were available. When we moved house, I gave them ALL to a friends little brother. I was about 14 and thought I'd grown out of them. I guess that's a common story with most Mego collectors. I still like Megos and will pick one up every now and again at a show if it's a reasonable price.
Best,
KEN
 

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<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 4:47 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] writing to John Chambers

In a message dated 5/26/01 7:29:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

That sculpture is gorgeous, but I think Scott said he bought it for him.
Also, last time I was there John left his Oscar and Emmy on the desk where
someone could snag it. He says sometimes he even uses it as a doorstop. The
only POTA Oscar in existence (until next year)!      - - - - Jeff K.

I'd love to see the Oscar footage of him getting that thing handed to him by
the chimp and Walter Matthau.

-- Rory

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<.html

I don't know where to begin an answer....after recently viewing all 5 apes
films again I realised they are all fantastic because of the emotional déjà
vu they cause me - they actually transfer me to a much happier youth.

The actual content of the films is a bit dated.

I think I like Beneath and Planet about the same.

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: MTotsky@... [MTotsky@...]
Sent: Sunday, 27 May 2001 15:05
To: pota@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [pota] Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their favorite
film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?

Matt

"Planet " is my favorite, but "Escape" is a close second. By the way,
according to "Behind the POTA" this month (May) is the 30th anniversary of
"Escape". Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes" movie I
saw. I came in when they were taking the helmets off and had my socks
knocked off! - - - - - Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: <MTotsky@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 10:04 PM
Subject: [pota] Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?


> I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their favorite
> film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?
>
> Matt
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Alexander Ruiz

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, May 25, 2001 6:26 PM

Subject: [pota] POTA WALLPAPER!

http://www.moviemalls.com/moviewallpapers.htm

 

Planet of the Apes PC Wallpaper.

 

Very nice.

 

All the best and have a great weekend.

 

Alex

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<.html

Hi Everyone!

"Jack Krueger" <williejoe@e...> wrote:

> "Planet " is my favorite, but "Escape" is a close second. By the

way,

> according to "Behind the POTA" this month (May) is the 30th

anniversary of

> "Escape". Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes"

movie I

I like PLANET and BENEATH together, and I look at ESCAPE, CONQUEST,
and BATTLE as a set, though that doesn't really answer the orig.
question.

ESCAPE was highly anticipated, I remember really being hyped to see
it. I was 19 at the time and was working as an asst. mgr. in the
local theatre. Back then, for you young readers, movies opened on
Wednesday, and the theatre was very busy from the first night thru
the 3rd weekend. I just wish I could remember which film was booked
as the 2nd feature!

I have an original ESCAPE lobby card that I love, it's the one with
Zira and Cornelius and the human doctor.

Best Wishes!
J. Crawford

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <MTotsky@a...>

[snip]

> > I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their

favorite

> > film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:06:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

I think I mentioned that Arthur Jacobs tried to do a "Frankenstein" movie?   
  - - - - Jeff K.

No, I haven't heard this one.  What's the story, Jeff?

-- Rory<.html

Fave moments:

PLANET: the opening credits; the Hunt; Zira's entrance; when Taylor
communicates with Zira; the office scene; It's A Madhouse!; courtroom scene;
"Damned Dirty Ape! Bloody Baboon" and any time Chuck beat up a gorilla --
Wouldn't we all like to see Chuck in a cage fighting real gorillas? But no
guns, Chuck! Gotta fight fair; "A Planet Where Apes Evolved From Men?" ; The
rifle sling blooper; kissing Zira goodbye -- Ugly? Me thinks she doth protest
too much, or so says that sly smile afterwards; the Statue
YM,YBIU,GDY,GDYATH!!!!!

BENEATH: the Ursus speech INVADE!; Zira's refusal; Zira at home baking
chocolate cake -- If Conelius smoked a pipe why didn't he like cigars?; The
extra reigns going into the cage on the runaway wagon; the bloody flamin'
Lawgiver; the Subway; mutant's bomb song; the end

ESCAPE: taking off the helmets; shopping trip; Zira at the hotel & party;
The Women's Club speech -- I'm all for women using their heads, as well as
their hands too, and I call on them to use them, on me! -- killing the
orderly; saying goodbye to Armando; saying goodbye to Lewis and Stevie;
Killing Dr. Haslein

CONQUEST: "Lousy human bastards!"; Caesar getting laid; Lou Wagner torching
the restaurant. When they're stockpiling weapons and a gorilla brings a
strainer.
When Caesar kills the shocktable operator. The battle.

BATTLE: Aldo's Guns = Power speech The armory scene; the time travel
speech; the end

TV SHOW: the Surgeon; the Interrogation; the blind chimpette; and just the
image of a hangliding ape.

Anyone see Pearl Harbor yet? If so, is it true that Ron Harper showed up in
it?

Matt

In a message dated 5/27/01 3:10:35 AM Central Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

<< Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes" movie I
saw. I came in when they were taking the helmets off and had my socks
knocked off! >>

Yeah, that little nose wiggle during Zira's intro and the way she puffs when
Cornelius is bitching at her in his office in Planet, classic Kim Hunter.
Very subtle. No one can manipulate an ape appliance like her. I always felt
McDowall over did it.

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:06:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Yeah, at the time I was into pretty much all of famous monsters of filmland.
In particular, I loved Frankenstein and Dracula. For a while, I use to
collect any dolls or figures of these characters but when I started
focussing on my APES collection, they kind of took a back seat. The reason
I had the Mego Frank was because at the time I had most of the Megos that
were available. When we moved house, I gave them ALL to a friends little
brother. I was about 14 and thought I'd grown out of them. I guess that's a
common story with most Mego collectors. I still like Megos and will pick
one up every now and again at a show if it's a reasonable price.
Best,
KEN

Well, I had to read this in a Jeff Krueger reply!  Good to see Yahoo is
working again.

Anyway. . . . .  Ken (and Jeff, too), have you gotten any of the figures from
Sideshow Toy?  They are great.  I've collected most of the 8" ones.  Now I
hear Sideshow won't be making anymore.  They are only going to do 12"
figures.  I have the Frankenstein and Wolf Man 12" figures, but I don't like
them that much.  "Dracula" 12" will be out soon, AND a Dwight Frye as Fritz
one!, but they're going to want $40 for it!  I may pass.

Oh, also. . . .  All the DVDs released so far of these films are wonderful.  
How I wish Fox was doing the same for the APES films.

The funny thing about the Universal Monster films with me is that you know
how I complain about the Apes sequels not being as good as the original, but
with the Frankenstein films, even though none are as good as "Bride of
Frankenstein" and the original, I don't care.  I just accept them as they
are.  I guess it's because they were made before I was born and I watched
them on TV from a very young age.  Next to "Bride" my favorite Frankenstein
film is "Frankenstein Meets the Wolf Man."  I can watch it again and again.  
I can't wait for the DVD.

Hey, maybe I should start a Universal Monsters egroup?

-- Rory<.html

<< I think I like Beneath and Planet about the same. >>

I like Escape second, though I like Beneath because it's still on the Planet!
But which is worse? The Planet with gorillas, or Earth with the real
animals, Humans?
Like the Johnny Cash song says ... Makes me want to grab my sub-mo-sheen-gun

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:10:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

"Planet " is my favorite, but "Escape" is a close second. By the way,
according to "Behind the POTA" this month (May) is the 30th anniversary of
"Escape". Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes" movie I
saw. I came in when they were taking the helmets off and had my socks
knocked off!                                  - - - - - Jeff K.

I believe that on May 28th, 1971 "ESCAPE" opened at the Astor Theatre in
Manhatten.  That would make tomorrow its 30th Anniversary.  It's hard to
believe it's 30 years old now.  Man, does it make me feel old.

Anyway, I was twelve when I first saw "ESCAPE" and I cried at the end.  
Anybody else cry when they first saw it?

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:12:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
whitty@... writes:

I don't know where to begin an answer....after recently viewing all 5 apes
films again I realised they are all fantastic because of the emotional déjà
vu they cause me - they actually transfer me to a much happier youth.

Your youth now isn't happy, Mike?

-- Rory :)<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:26:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Two bits of news this week about progress on the new "Apes" film.
"Variety"'s Army Archerd reported on Thursday that Fox has seen the rough
cut and liked it. Sequel talk is even more rampant.

Movieheadlines.net says that FX house ILM is starting to give "Apes" more
attention .Burton apparently likes what he sees and wants them to add more
stuff (whereas folks like George Lucas and Robert Zemeckis have embraced
computer graphics, Burton is more of a traditionalist. Thus, the emphasis
of "in camera" shots instead of actors in front of blue backgrounds ). Man,
with 2 months to go it looks like things are going to be tight!             
              - - - - Jeff K.

Yeah, I can't help but to think the film may suffer from all this rush.  
Well, this news makes me feel a little better.  After seeing the preview in
the theatre yesterday, and hearing nothing from the audience, I've been
beginning to feel most people aren't going to be into this film.  I want it
to do well, even if I end up not liking it because it's not the way I want it
to be.

-- Rory<.html

In a message dated 5/27/01 7:31:45 AM Central Daylight Time,
happyfortune@... writes:

<< ESCAPE was highly anticipated, I remember really being hyped to see it. >>

I was 10 when Escape came out. I was in Montana at Lost Trails Camp that
summer, hundreds of miles from a theater, when I saw a newspaper ad. As you
remember the Earth had been blown up in the last one, so I wasn't expecting
another one. I was stoked to see it!

Attachments :

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 8:31:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
happyfortune@... writes:

ESCAPE was highly anticipated, I remember really being hyped to see
it. I was 19 at the time and was working as an asst. mgr. in the
local theatre. Back then, for you young readers, movies opened on
Wednesday, and the theatre was very busy from the first night thru
the 3rd weekend. I just wish I could remember which film was booked
as the 2nd feature!

I have an original ESCAPE lobby card that I love, it's the one with
Zira and Cornelius and the human doctor.

Best Wishes!
J. Crawford

Yeah, I remember that, movies always opened on Wednesday.  In fact, John
Landis uses "See You Next Wednesday" in all his films in reference to that
(and a film he never made).

See my attached PLANET posters again to see how movies used to open on
Wednesday.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 9:03:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
LordTZer0@... writes:

The
rifle sling blooper

What's that, T?

-- Rory<.html

In a message dated 5/27/01 8:08:59 AM Central Daylight Time, MTotsky@...
writes:

<< Anyone see Pearl Harbor yet? >>

AKA flashy deaths for pretty boys?
I heard one review say it could well be, the worst movie ever made.
I'd hate to get pulled in by the hype, but what else is out?

In a message dated 5/27/01 8:15:36 AM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@...
writes:

<< I loved Frankenstein and Dracula. >>

Don't forget the Wolfman and The Creature From The Black Lagoon.
They may be why I dig FX make ups so much.

.htmlWell, the Internet Movie Database says that Ron Harper plays a minister in
"Pearl Harbor."   However, I went and saw it yesterday, and I was looking for
him, but I didn't see him.  Not that director Michael Bay makes it easy.  
There's hardly a shot in the movie that lasts longer than five seconds!  I
hate the way this guy makes films.

The special effects are great in this movie, but all the rest of it is a
bunch of hokey, sappy shit.  I don't think it deserves to make the money it
will make.

One thing to thank the Lawgiver for is that Bay didn't make the new APES film.

-- Rory<.html

.html <.html

> I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their
> favorite film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?
>
> Matt

PLANET isn't my favourite because I don't find it very emotionally
involving as far as the characters go, and that's important to me.
But I do rank it number one of the five on an intellectual level. /Mez

So, come on, cough it up...what's your favorite, Mez?

- - - - Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mez Downes" <mdownes@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 8:59 AM
Subject: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?


> > I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their
> > favorite film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?
> >
> > Matt
>
> PLANET isn't my favourite because I don't find it very emotionally
> involving as far as the characters go, and that's important to me.
> But I do rank it number one of the five on an intellectual level. /Mez
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Thanks, that was interesting. I don't think we've heard from you
- - - Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: <happyfortune@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 5:22 AM
Subject: [pota] ESCAPE memories [was Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?]


> Hi Everyone!
>
> "Jack Krueger" <williejoe@e...> wrote:
> > "Planet " is my favorite, but "Escape" is a close second. By the
> way,
> > according to "Behind the POTA" this month (May) is the 30th
> anniversary of
> > "Escape". Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes"
> movie I
>
> I like PLANET and BENEATH together, and I look at ESCAPE, CONQUEST,
> and BATTLE as a set, though that doesn't really answer the orig.
> question.
>
> ESCAPE was highly anticipated, I remember really being hyped to see
> it. I was 19 at the time and was working as an asst. mgr. in the
> local theatre. Back then, for you young readers, movies opened on
> Wednesday, and the theatre was very busy from the first night thru
> the 3rd weekend. I just wish I could remember which film was booked
> as the 2nd feature!
>
> I have an original ESCAPE lobby card that I love, it's the one with
> Zira and Cornelius and the human doctor.
>
> Best Wishes!
> J. Crawford
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <MTotsky@a...>
> [snip]
> > > I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their
> favorite
> > > film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 5:45 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Before There Were Medicoms

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:06:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

I think I mentioned that Arthur Jacobs tried to do a "Frankenstein" movie?   
  - - - - Jeff K.

No, I haven't heard this one.  What's the story, Jeff?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

Good point LordT: if Cornelius smokes a pipe, why can't he smoke a cigar
(besides the fact Roddy hadn't seen "Beneath" when he did "Escape")? I'm no
expert since I don't smoke, but I've heard cigars are particularly nasty.
Also, perhaps the apes have a much milder tobacco?

- -
- Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: <LordTZer0@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 6:00 AM
Subject: Re: [pota] Favorite POTA moments.


>
> Fave moments:
>
> PLANET: the opening credits; the Hunt; Zira's entrance; when Taylor
> communicates with Zira; the office scene; It's A Madhouse!; courtroom
scene;
> "Damned Dirty Ape! Bloody Baboon" and any time Chuck beat up a gorilla --
> Wouldn't we all like to see Chuck in a cage fighting real gorillas? But
no
> guns, Chuck! Gotta fight fair; "A Planet Where Apes Evolved From Men?" ;
The
> rifle sling blooper; kissing Zira goodbye -- Ugly? Me thinks she doth
protest
> too much, or so says that sly smile afterwards; the Statue
> YM,YBIU,GDY,GDYATH!!!!!
>
> BENEATH: the Ursus speech INVADE!; Zira's refusal; Zira at home baking
> chocolate cake -- If Conelius smoked a pipe why didn't he like cigars?;
The
> extra reigns going into the cage on the runaway wagon; the bloody flamin'
> Lawgiver; the Subway; mutant's bomb song; the end
>
> ESCAPE: taking off the helmets; shopping trip; Zira at the hotel & party;
> The Women's Club speech -- I'm all for women using their heads, as well as
> their hands too, and I call on them to use them, on me! -- killing the
> orderly; saying goodbye to Armando; saying goodbye to Lewis and Stevie;
> Killing Dr. Haslein
>
> CONQUEST: "Lousy human bastards!"; Caesar getting laid; Lou Wagner
torching
> the restaurant. When they're stockpiling weapons and a gorilla brings a
> strainer.
> When Caesar kills the shocktable operator. The battle.
>
> BATTLE: Aldo's Guns = Power speech The armory scene; the time travel
> speech; the end
>
> TV SHOW: the Surgeon; the Interrogation; the blind chimpette; and just
the
> image of a hangliding ape.
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 6:11 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Before There Were Medicoms

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:06:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Yeah, at the time I was into pretty much all of famous monsters of filmland.
In particular, I loved Frankenstein and Dracula. For a while, I use to
collect any dolls or figures of these characters but when I started
focussing on my APES collection, they kind of took a back seat. The reason
I had the Mego Frank was because at the time I had most of the Megos that
were available. When we moved house, I gave them ALL to a friends little
brother. I was about 14 and thought I'd grown out of them. I guess that's a
common story with most Mego collectors. I still like Megos and will pick
one up every now and again at a show if it's a reasonable price.
Best,
KEN

Well, I had to read this in a Jeff Krueger reply!  Good to see Yahoo is
working again.

Anyway. . . . .  Ken (and Jeff, too), have you gotten any of the figures from
Sideshow Toy?  They are great.  I've collected most of the 8" ones.  Now I
hear Sideshow won't be making anymore.  They are only going to do 12"
figures.  I have the Frankenstein and Wolf Man 12" figures, but I don't like
them that much.  "Dracula" 12" will be out soon, AND a Dwight Frye as Fritz
one!, but they're going to want $40 for it!  I may pass.

Oh, also. . . .  All the DVDs released so far of these films are wonderful.  
How I wish Fox was doing the same for the APES films.

The funny thing about the Universal Monster films with me is that you know
how I complain about the Apes sequels not being as good as the original, but
with the Frankenstein films, even though none are as good as "Bride of
Frankenstein" and the original, I don't care.  I just accept them as they
are.  I guess it's because they were made before I was born and I watched
them on TV from a very young age.  Next to "Bride" my favorite Frankenstein
film is "Frankenstein Meets the Wolf Man."  I can watch it again and again.  
I can't wait for the DVD.

Hey, maybe I should start a Universal Monsters egroup?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 6:20 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:10:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

"Planet " is my favorite, but "Escape" is a close second. By the way,
according to "Behind the POTA" this month (May) is the 30th anniversary of
"Escape". Any "Escape" memories? I remember it was the first "Apes" movie I
saw. I came in when they were taking the helmets off and had my socks
knocked off!                                  - - - - - Jeff K.

I believe that on May 28th, 1971 "ESCAPE" opened at the Astor Theatre in
Manhatten.  That would make tomorrow its 30th Anniversary.  It's hard to
believe it's 30 years old now.  Man, does it make me feel old.

Anyway, I was twelve when I first saw "ESCAPE" and I cried at the end.  
Anybody else cry when they first saw it?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 12:24:13 PM Central Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

> I like PLANET and BENEATH together, and I look at ESCAPE, CONQUEST,
> and BATTLE as a set, though that doesn't really answer the orig.
> question.

I'd say Planet is THE BEST without a doubt,but Beneath is cool too (like
someone said,it is the other one actually set on the Planet of the Apes).And
for me,I always looked at the first three as "the trilogy" of the series,not
the last three.Maybe its because thats the way they used to show them here.On
the All Night Theatre they'd show the first three in a row on a Friday
night,so I got used to seeing them that way.They never showed Conquest or
Battle though.Instead during their APES week,they'd show the 1933 King Kong
(on Monday night) and Son of Kong (on Tuesday night) then the Apes films
during the rest of the week.Or as I said,sometimes they'd run the first three
in a row on a Friday night.

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 6:25 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Production report

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:26:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Two bits of news this week about progress on the new "Apes" film.
"Variety"'s Army Archerd reported on Thursday that Fox has seen the rough
cut and liked it. Sequel talk is even more rampant.

Movieheadlines.net says that FX house ILM is starting to give "Apes" more
attention .Burton apparently likes what he sees and wants them to add more
stuff (whereas folks like George Lucas and Robert Zemeckis have embraced
computer graphics, Burton is more of a traditionalist. Thus, the emphasis
of "in camera" shots instead of actors in front of blue backgrounds ). Man,
with 2 months to go it looks like things are going to be tight!             
              - - - - Jeff K.

Yeah, I can't help but to think the film may suffer from all this rush.  
Well, this news makes me feel a little better.  After seeing the preview in
the theatre yesterday, and hearing nothing from the audience, I've been
beginning to feel most people aren't going to be into this film.  I want it
to do well, even if I end up not liking it because it's not the way I want it
to be.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 6:33 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] ESCAPE memories [was Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?]

In a message dated 5/27/01 8:31:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
happyfortune@... writes:

ESCAPE was highly anticipated, I remember really being hyped to see
it. I was 19 at the time and was working as an asst. mgr. in the
local theatre. Back then, for you young readers, movies opened on
Wednesday, and the theatre was very busy from the first night thru
the 3rd weekend. I just wish I could remember which film was booked
as the 2nd feature!

I have an original ESCAPE lobby card that I love, it's the one with
Zira and Cornelius and the human doctor.

Best Wishes!
J. Crawford

Yeah, I remember that, movies always opened on Wednesday.  In fact, John
Landis uses "See You Next Wednesday" in all his films in reference to that
(and a film he never made).

See my attached PLANET posters again to see how movies used to open on
Wednesday.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

---

<.html

.html

Subj: Re: [pota] Favorite POTA moments.

Well everyone seems to have a lot of the same favorite moments as I do,so
there is no need to really type those again.But I will say I like the look on
Taylor's face when he see's the gorillas in the hunt (he kinda looks like
"holy sh**").And the expression on Zira's face after the "Take your stinking
paws off me..." line (same as above,a very surprised look).

But I'm sure I'll think of others that haven't been listed.If I do,I'll post
those too.

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 7:21 AM

Subject: [pota] Pearl Harbor?

Well, the Internet Movie Database says that Ron Harper plays a minister in
"Pearl Harbor."   However, I went and saw it yesterday, and I was looking for
him, but I didn't see him.  Not that director Michael Bay makes it easy.  
There's hardly a shot in the movie that lasts longer than five seconds!  I
hate the way this guy makes films.

The special effects are great in this movie, but all the rest of it is a
bunch of hokey, sappy shit.  I don't think it deserves to make the money it
will make.

One thing to thank the Lawgiver for is that Bay didn't make the new APES film.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

> So, come on, cough it up...what's your favorite, Mez?
>
> - -

- - Jeff

Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
tearful ending....

Okay, NOW I've got to go pop the video in. /Mez

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 1:23:03 PM Central Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Peter Jackson of the new "Lord of the Rings" teamed with Roddy in '92 to get
an "Apes" movie going. They wanted to continue from the originals but Fox
wouldn't have it.

I didn't know about this at all.Do you have any details as to what type of
story line Roddy would have liked to see?

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 1:46:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
mdownes@... writes:

Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
tearful ending....

Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to it.I like
the way the novelization handled it more than the film.

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 2:19:20 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Good point LordT: if Cornelius smokes a pipe, why can't he smoke a cigar
(besides the fact Roddy hadn't seen "Beneath" when he did "Escape")? I'm no
expert since I don't smoke, but I've heard cigars are particularly nasty.
Also, perhaps the apes have a much milder tobacco?

                                                                        - -
- Jeff K.

The apes didn't smoke tobacco, they smoked 'weed.'  Couldn't you see it
growing on the hills all around Ape City?   Why else do you think they
freaked out at talking men?!

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 2:23:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Peter Jackson of the new "Lord of the Rings" teamed with Roddy in '92 to get
an "Apes" movie going. They wanted to continue from the originals but Fox
wouldn't have it.  

Wow!!  I never heard that one before!!  Got any further details?

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 2:52:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mlccougar@... writes:

Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
tearful ending....

Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to it.I like
the way the novelization handled it more than the film.


The only thing that really bothers me about "ESCAPE" is you can see them
getting cheaper with the make-up and now Roddy's got Kim's wig on too.  Other
than that, it's the best of the sequels.

-- Rory<.html

--- In pota@y..., mlccougar@a... wrote:

> Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to
> it. I like the way the novelization handled it more than the film.

Yeah, I prefer darker too. But aside from that, "Escape" as a film is
near downright perfect where my tastes are concerned.

The novelization left me a little flat in the character department.
Just read as too detached from everything. And it didn't seem as
clearly thought out in some details either. Like no one remarks that
these are human-sized chimps. In fact at the beginning the zoo
keeper, Jim Haskins, thinks to himself only that these chimps must
have been someone's pets! You can get away with oversights like that
in film because we see them and the reaction to their appearance; in
a book you need to be more careful about the picture you're drawing
in the reader's mind. /Mez

.htmlWell, I've just spent the last hour and a half on this lazy Sunday afternoon
painting all those little plates on the Ursus Medicom the silver they should
be.  Boy, was that tedious, but I just had to do it. Now he looks 'right' (as
in right-wing fascist).

Now, I'll think about giving the Lawgiver his proper paint job.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 3:18:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mdownes@... writes:

The novelization left me a little flat in the character department.
Just read as too detached from everything. And it didn't seem as
clearly thought out in some details either. Like no one remarks that
these are human-sized chimps. In fact at the beginning the zoo
keeper, Jim Haskins, thinks to himself only that these chimps must
have been someone's pets! You can get away with oversights like that
in film because we see them and the reaction to their appearance; in
a book you need to be more careful about the picture you're drawing
in the reader's mind. /Mez

I remember the novelization for "Escape" was done be a true Sci-Fi writer,
Jerry Pournelle (or something).  I think he was trying to make the story as
realistic as possible.  I haven't read it in twenty-five years, but I
remember it was good.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 2:28:10 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@...
writes:

I remember the novelization for "Escape" was done be a true Sci-Fi writer,
Jerry Pournelle (or something).  I think he was trying to make the story as
realistic as possible.  I haven't read it in twenty-five years, but I
remember it was good.

You are correct on the name Rory.And to me,it was handled very well by his
writing.<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 2:28:10 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@...
writes:

Like no one remarks that these are human-sized chimps.

I never gave that a thought except that they were human sized because they
were played by human actors.

I suppose they could end up being larger though because of the genetic
breeding ,etc..But I always thought of them as just looking like regular apes
(in the novelization that is),because if they looked like they did in the
films,then everyone would KNOW they aren't just chimps,that they are evolved
creatures and I'm sure they wouldn't have been put in with the regular "well
trained"chimp catagory.

<.html

.html Don't forget to add the base, Rory!!!

Haristas@... wrote:..

 
Now, I'll think about giving the Lawgiver his proper paint job.

-- Rory

<.html

Amen! Happy 30th, "Escape". - - - - - Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mez Downes" <mdownes@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 11:38 AM
Subject: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?


> > So, come on, cough it up...what's your favorite, Mez?
> >
> > - -
> - - Jeff
>
> Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
> philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
> tearful ending....
>
> Okay, NOW I've got to go pop the video in. /Mez
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: mlccougar@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 11:47 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Pearl Harbor?

In a message dated 5/27/01 1:23:03 PM Central Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Peter Jackson of the new "Lord of the Rings" teamed with Roddy in '92 to get
an "Apes" movie going. They wanted to continue from the originals but Fox
wouldn't have it.

I didn't know about this at all.Do you have any details as to what type of
story line Roddy would have liked to see?

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: mlccougar@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 11:51 AM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 1:46:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
mdownes@... writes:

Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
tearful ending....

Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to it.I like
the way the novelization handled it more than the film.

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 12:18 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 2:52:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mlccougar@... writes:

Like you, "Escape", of course! Bit of humour, intriguing
philosophical questions, moral dilemma, characters I can care about,
tearful ending....

Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to it.I like
the way the novelization handled it more than the film.

The only thing that really bothers me about "ESCAPE" is you can see them
getting cheaper with the make-up and now Roddy's got Kim's wig on too.  Other
than that, it's the best of the sequels.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 12:25 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 3:18:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mdownes@... writes:

The novelization left me a little flat in the character department.
Just read as too detached from everything. And it didn't seem as
clearly thought out in some details either. Like no one remarks that
these are human-sized chimps. In fact at the beginning the zoo
keeper, Jim Haskins, thinks to himself only that these chimps must
have been someone's pets! You can get away with oversights like that
in film because we see them and the reaction to their appearance; in
a book you need to be more careful about the picture you're drawing
in the reader's mind. /Mez

I remember the novelization for "Escape" was done be a true Sci-Fi writer,
Jerry Pournelle (or something).  I think he was trying to make the story as
realistic as possible.  I haven't read it in twenty-five years, but I
remember it was good.

-- Rory

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<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:29:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
afryt4u@... writes:

Don't forget to add the base, Rory!!!

Yes, well realizing that, and that the thing is already painted, and that the
old paint would have to be removed first -- I decided against it.  Maybe in
future I'll get ambitious again.  As for the base (I assumed above that you
meant a base coat of paint.) I was looking one day at this wooden coaster I
have a set of.  I turned it over and and thought, "That would make a great
base for the Lawgiver," and so it has.   I didn't glue him to it, though.  
He's just stuck there with double-sided tape.

-- Rory<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: mlccougar@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 12:40 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 2:28:10 PM Central Daylight Time, Haristas@...
writes:

Like no one remarks that these are human-sized chimps.

I never gave that a thought except that they were human sized because they
were played by human actors.

I suppose they could end up being larger though because of the genetic
breeding ,etc..But I always thought of them as just looking like regular apes
(in the novelization that is),because if they looked like they did in the
films,then everyone would KNOW they aren't just chimps,that they are evolved
creatures and I'm sure they wouldn't have been put in with the regular "well
trained"chimp catagory.

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:50:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

For the last 3 "Apes" films, Fox was controlled by the banks. Richard Zanuck
had been fired. That's why it's so ironic (and delicious) that Fox's hopes
are in "Apes" now.       - - - Jeff K.

Irony is sort of what "Apes" is all about in the first place, isn't it?

-- Rory<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 1:54 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Oh those Medicoms!

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:29:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
afryt4u@... writes:

Don't forget to add the base, Rory!!!

Yes, well realizing that, and that the thing is already painted, and that the
old paint would have to be removed first -- I decided against it.  Maybe in
future I'll get ambitious again.  As for the base (I assumed above that you
meant a base coat of paint.) I was looking one day at this wooden coaster I
have a set of.  I turned it over and and thought, "That would make a great
base for the Lawgiver," and so it has.   I didn't glue him to it, though.  
He's just stuck there with double-sided tape.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 4:56:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Conquest" was the best novelization, "Escape" second . "Battle" third,
"Beneath" a joke. Boulle in a class by himself.

                                                                 - - -
Truman Apepote

Yeah, the "Conquest" novelization was excellent.  I remember a scene where
they had Caesar locked up in some cage and he had to 'go' right there.  
Couldn't do that in a family film.  Also, writers of books don't need to be
concerned with budgets.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlOkay, I just thought of this.  I think I'm right, but maybe your answers will
prove me wrong.

Who is the POTA character in the series (not in just one film) who has the
most outfits (or change of clothes)?

I'll give my answer in a couple hours.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 5:07:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

 Rory - -

I'm sure Brian means a base for the statue.         - - - Jeff K.

I think so, too.  Someday I'll get some clay and make a proper one 'based' on
photos, but for now the wooden coaster turned upside down will do.

-- Rory<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 1:54:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
pota@yahoogroups.com writes:

> I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their
favorite
> > film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?

My favorite is "Escape" with its tragic love story. I know we  couldn't have
had "Escape'if we hadn't had "Planet" first but "Escape" is still my favorite.
<.html

Attachments :

.htmlOh yeah, I do mean just an ape character here.  That should make it easy.<.html

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 5:01:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
pota@yahoogroups.com writes:

Escape is cool,but I do wish it would have had a "darker" tone to it.I like
the way the novelization handled it more than the film.

Gee, both of the lead characters (Cornelius & Zira) die at the end of
"Escape", the only ray of hope is that their baby survives. The film always
leaves me with a tear in my eye and you want it darker ??!!
<.html

In a message dated 5/27/01 3:28:35 PM, Haristas@... writes:

<< Well, I've just spent the last hour and a half on this lazy Sunday
afternoon
painting all those little plates on the Ursus Medicom the silver they should
be. Boy, was that tedious, but I just had to do it. Now he looks 'right' (as
in right-wing fascist). >>

Pics! We need to see pics!

Matt

.html

Your youth now isn't happy, Mike?

-- Rory :)

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .
<.html

.html <.html

.html <.html

Well stated Mez.

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: Mez Downes [mdownes@...]
Sent: Monday, 28 May 2001 1:59
To: pota@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

> I was just curious if anyone here doesn't prefer PLANET as their
> favorite film out of the original five. If this is the case, why?
>
> Matt

PLANET isn't my favourite because I don't find it very emotionally
involving as far as the characters go, and that's important to me.
But I do rank it number one of the five on an intellectual level. /Mez

.html In a message dated 5/27/01 2:23:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Peter Jackson of the new "Lord of the Rings" teamed with Roddy in '92 to get
an "Apes" movie going. They wanted to continue from the originals but Fox
wouldn't have it.  

Wow!!  I never heard that one before!!  Got any further details?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
<.html

In a message dated 05/27/2001 5:55:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
whitty@... writes:

<< Nah - too complicated/too many responsibilities!

Michael >>

I know what you mean. Ah, for the days when you're a kid and you know
nothing of having to make money and pay bills and worry about this or that,.

Rory

In a message dated 05/27/2001 5:57:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
whitty@... writes:

<< Rory

They were just stunned!

Michael >>

Nah, just eating their popcorn mostly.

Rory

.html Generally U.S distributors ( and sometimes in Australia) open films a day early so they can report 'record breaking' weekend box office numbers in their marketing campaigns.
Best,
KEN

Michael Whitty wrote:

 They open Thursday in Australia - which is Wednesday in the US!Michael 

-----Original Message-----
From: Haristas@... [mailto:Haristas@...]
Sent: Sunday, 27 May 2001 23:33
To: pota@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [pota] ESCAPE memories [was Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?]

See my attached PLANET posters again to see how movies used to open on
Wednesday.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

<.html

--- In pota@y..., mlccougar@a... wrote:

> I never gave that a thought except that they were human sized
> because they were played by human actors.

Okay. But would you still have thought they were human-sized if you'd
read the novelization *prior* to any exposure to the films? That's my
point.

You'll have to forgive me -- I'm not slamming Pournelle or trying to
be anal. Judging from the original copyright date and dialogue it's
likely he was working from a semi-final draft of the script and may
even have been instructed not to bother describing the chimps.
('Leave the shock value for the release of the film' kind of thing.)
It's just the writer in me. Where books are concerned I look for
weakness or flaw as a pasttime. ;)

> I suppose they could end up being larger though because of the
> genetic breeding ,etc..But I always thought of them as just looking
> like regular apes (in the novelization that is),because if they
> looked like they did in the films,then everyone would KNOW they
> aren't just chimps,that they are evolved creatures and I'm sure
> they wouldn't have been put in with the regular "well trained"chimp
> catagory.

Well, that happened in both the film and the novelization. Which
always struck me as funny in the film because they *are* so different
looking to contemporary chimps. I would hope that if three human-
sized, upright-walking chimps in spacesuits washed up on our shores
this minute, our initial reaction would not be to throw them in a zoo!

So are you saying that, in terms of the book, you envisioned
Cornelius and Zira as being no different looking than chimps are
today? Except they could talk? /Mez

.html Anyway. . . . .  Ken (and Jeff, too), have you gotten any of the figures from
Sideshow Toy?  They are great.  I've collected most of the 8" ones.  Now I
hear Sideshow won't be making anymore.  They are only going to do 12"
figures.  I have the Frankenstein and Wolf Man 12" figures, but I don't like
them that much.  "Dracula" 12" will be out soon, AND a Dwight Frye as Fritz
one!, but they're going to want $40 for it!  I may pass.
 

Yeah, these guys do a great job, but I haven't bought any. Saving my pennies for the APE onslaught.
I think these guys are also doing a 12 inch 'Young Frankenstein' ( Mel Brook's funniest movie) line which would be fun. They're actually B&W figures.
Oh, and LordT, you're right, how could I forget 'The Creature', he's one of my other favourites.
For the record, "Bride" is my fave Frank movie.
Best,
KEN
 

 

<.html

Please please please, Jeff!!

And did Roddy ever share particulars about what direction the series
might have taken? I always got the feeling from his interviews that
there were some firm ideas about it -- before it was ripped off the
airwaves. /Mez

> Yes please I want to know more too!!!
>
> I would have loved to have spoken to Roddy about how the series may
> have been concluded.
>
> Michael

Anyway, I was twelve when I first saw "ESCAPE" and I cried at the end.
Anybody else cry when they first saw it?

-- Rory

I was also 12 when I first saw 'Escape' on TV ( sometime in '75). Cry? I
was traumatized by the ending. I just couldn't believe that they kill
off my two favourite characters. You're right Jeff, they'd never get
that ending past the test audiences these days.
Best,
KEN

> I was also 12 when I first saw 'Escape' on TV ( sometime in '75).
> Cry? I was traumatized by the ending. I just couldn't believe that
> they kill off my two favourite characters. You're right Jeff,
> they'd never get that ending past the test audiences these days.
> Best,
> KEN

I was around 11 when I saw Escape, and for a short time afterwards I
was mighty untrusting of helicopters! LOL -- Ah, the good ol'
days before Hollywood became Hollyweird. /Mez

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Haristas@...

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 2:04 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Re: Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?

In a message dated 5/27/01 4:56:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Conquest" was the best novelization, "Escape" second . "Battle" third,
"Beneath" a joke. Boulle in a class by himself.

                                                                 - - -
Truman Apepote

Yeah, the "Conquest" novelization was excellent.  I remember a scene where
they had Caesar locked up in some cage and he had to 'go' right there.  
Couldn't do that in a family film.  Also, writers of books don't need to be
concerned with budgets.

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael Whitty

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 3:01 PM

Subject: [pota] Roddy's POTA Project

Yes please I want to know more too!!!

 

I would have loved to have spoken to Roddy about how the series may have been concluded.

 

Michael

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Haristas@... [mailto:Haristas@...]
Sent: Monday, 28 May 2001 5:14
To: pota@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [pota] Pearl Harbor?

In a message dated 5/27/01 2:23:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

Peter Jackson of the new "Lord of the Rings" teamed with Roddy in '92 to get
an "Apes" movie going. They wanted to continue from the originals but Fox
wouldn't have it.  

Wow!!  I never heard that one before!!  Got any further details?

-- Rory

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

Bills? What are those? - - - - Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: <Haristas@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?


> In a message dated 05/27/2001 5:55:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> whitty@... writes:
>
> << Nah - too complicated/too many responsibilities!
>
> Michael >>
>
> I know what you mean. Ah, for the days when you're a kid and you know
> nothing of having to make money and pay bills and worry about this or
that,.
>
> Rory
>
>
>
>
>
>

.htmlIn a message dated 5/27/01 5:17:35 PM Central Daylight Time,
mdownes@... writes:

Okay. But would you still have thought they were human-sized if you'd
read the novelization *prior* to any exposure to the films? That's my
point.
Well,that really is hard to say for sure.I'd like to think that yes,I would
have envisioned them as just looking like run of the mill chimps.But as you
say,I did see the films before I ever read any of the novels,so it is hard
to really say.
You'll have to forgive me -- I'm not slamming Pournelle or trying to
be anal. Judging from the original copyright date and dialogue it's
likely he was working from a semi-final draft of the script and may
even have been instructed not to bother describing the chimps.
('Leave the shock value for the release of the film' kind of thing.)
It's just the writer in me. Where books are concerned I look for
weakness or flaw as a pasttime. ;)
I don't think you're being anal,its ok to be critical of others works.But
from the very little I know of Pournelle (and it is almost nothing),I think
he is very into what is and isn't.I mean I heard once that he said "Star
Wars" isn't sci-fi (I agree with  that even if it wasn't Pournelle who said
it,but thats beside the point).What I'm trying to get at here is
this:Because he takes his works seriously,and he seems hardcore as to what
sci-fi is,then he wouldn't change the apes appearances.I mean he would take
what exists already and then just change it up to a point.The point in Apes
being,ok apes have aquired speech and intelligence.But their appearances
don't have to change because of it.He seems to be a "what if" type of
writer.But I haven't read any other books by him so I could be wrong.
> I suppose they could end up being larger though because of the
> genetic breeding ,etc..But I always thought of them as just looking
> like regular apes (in the novelization that is),because if they
> looked like they did in the films,then everyone would KNOW they
> aren't just chimps,that they are evolved creatures and I'm sure
> they wouldn't have been put in with the regular "well trained"chimp
> catagory.

Well, that happened in both the film and the novelization. Which
always struck me as funny in the film because they *are* so different
looking to contemporary chimps. I would hope that if three human-
sized, upright-walking chimps in spacesuits washed up on our shores
this minute, our initial reaction would not be to throw them in a zoo!
Yes,I know that too.Thats my point .I'm saying that because of their very
different appearance,it'd be obvious that they aren't run of the mill
chimps.I'm trying to say that when I read the novel its easier to picture
their initial treatment because I do try to picture them as regular looking
chimps,not the evolved ones that they are.Thats where the film's lower
budget comes into being criticized.I mean that if we are to believe that
the 3 Ape-o-nauts were "real" apes,then shouldn't have the other apes had
the same look as them,for more realism?Then by the time of Conquest they
all have that look and at this point in the game they couldn't have evolved
that much,so they'd have to be from the same genetic makeup as the dumb
ones in Escape.Their intelligence may have been on the rise in Conquest but
their look couldn't have changed that much "over night".I know I rambled on
too much here,but I hope you get what I'm trying to say.
So are you saying that, in terms of the book, you envisioned
Cornelius and Zira as being no different looking than chimps are
today? Except they could talk? /Mez

Yes,this is what I'm trying to say in terms of reading the novelization.I do
try to picture them as what I know chimps to look like.It makes it more
believable to me.I hope all my nonsense makes sense to you and that you can
see the point I'm trying to make here.

<.html

.html

----- Original Message -----

From: Ken & Heather Taylor

To: pota@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 3:21 PM

Subject: Re: [pota] Before There Were Medicoms

Anyway. . . . .  Ken (and Jeff, too), have you gotten any of the figures from
Sideshow Toy?  They are great.  I've collected most of the 8" ones.  Now I
hear Sideshow won't be making anymore.  They are only going to do 12"
figures.  I have the Frankenstein and Wolf Man 12" figures, but I don't like
them that much.  "Dracula" 12" will be out soon, AND a Dwight Frye as Fritz
one!, but they're going to want $40 for it!  I may pass.
 

Yeah, these guys do a great job, but I haven't bought any. Saving my pennies for the APE onslaught.
I think these guys are also doing a 12 inch 'Young Frankenstein' ( Mel Brook's funniest movie) line which would be fun. They're actually B&W figures.
Oh, and LordT, you're right, how could I forget 'The Creature', he's one of my other favourites.
For the record, "Bride" is my fave Frank movie.
Best,
KEN
 

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the .

<.html

I'll do what I can. But Brian knows the dude better than I do.

- - - - -
Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mez Downes" <mdownes@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 3:29 PM
Subject: [pota] Re: Roddy's POTA Project


> Please please please, Jeff!!
>
> And did Roddy ever share particulars about what direction the series
> might have taken? I always got the feeling from his interviews that
> there were some firm ideas about it -- before it was ripped off the
> airwaves. /Mez
>
> > Yes please I want to know more too!!!
> >
> > I would have loved to have spoken to Roddy about how the series may
> > have been concluded.
> >
> > Michael
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

In a message dated 05/27/2001 7:05:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
williejoe@... writes:

<< I'll talk to my friend about what he knows. - - - - Jeff K.

P.S.: Suddenly I'm getting e-mails doubled from everyone. Any suggestions?

>>

Just ignore it. Just ignore it. You're caught in a time slip. You're
caught in a time slip.

Rory
Rory

I have to say this feels really good to hear this. I guess we don't have to
say "Real "Apes" fans don't cry". And I can't think of a better 30th
Anniversary tribute to "Escape". Really, how many science fiction films make
you cry?

- - - - -
Jeff K.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken & Heather Taylor" <kentaylor@...>
To: <pota@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [pota] Who Doesn't Prefer PLANET?


> Anyway, I was twelve when I first saw "ESCAPE" and I cried at the end.
> Anybody else cry when they first saw it?
>
> -- Rory
>
> I was also 12 when I first saw 'Escape' on TV ( sometime in '75). Cry? I
> was traumatized by the ending. I just couldn't believe that they kill
> off my two favourite characters. You're right Jeff, they'd never get
> that ending past the test audiences these days.
> Best,
> KEN
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>