--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "." <aquaboi@...> wrote:
>
> im not trying to be offensive, and im not trying to censor anyones posts here but i am not getting what i wanted out of the group.
> is there another discussion group available that someone can reccomend that talks about the movies, the models, the fan stories?
> i kind of really want to get into the planet of the apes, and to be honest, not have ten or so emails every day about how much money the new movie is making world wide or how black people are ape related.
> thank you.
> Â jim
>
> From: JohnM conquest-idor <johnmermigas@...>
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 7:28 AM
> Subject: [pota] Re: R.I.P. Film Score Monthly soundtracks
>
>
> Â
> FSM is responsible for Beneath and Conquest/Battle. Escape and Planet are from VareseSarabande and the FSM soundtracks will be available till the 3000 copies are exuasted. Beneath I think is gone and you have to buy from second tier sellers. Conquest/Battle is still available. Escape and POTA68 are available. The TV series from Intrada is all gone and commands prices from 50-250 dollars-amazing.
>
> On another subject ,I got the feeling that the writers of Rise were given credit as producers as a deal or compromise or a favor-what a favor. The reel producers are Chernin and company. Take care, John M.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "georgetaylor68" <georgetaylor68@> wrote:
> >
> > Is Film Score Monthly's demise going to mean that soundtracks for the Escape from the Planet of the Apes, and Beneath the Planet of the Apes films will no longer be available even at Amazon.com, unless from collectors? I was hoping that Rise's release would boost production and lower the prices. I have all the other Apes soundtracks.
> >
> > Thanks for the info. distinguishing GNP Crescendo, by the way.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, lawford42@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Definitely not good news, but after reading article on the FSM website I
> > > completely understand why. Having been associated with an independent
> > > music label once, I especially understand the paperwork nightmares.
> > >
> > > Still, it's an impressive run of work, and I'm glad I was able to
> > > contribute (in my own small way) to the release of the CONQUEST/BATTLE
> > > score which- in turn- got me a credit in the 'Special Thanks' section.
> > > Between that and facilitating the audio corrections in BENEATH (on the
> > > Blu ray version), it cool to get involved in this stuff.
> > >
> > > BTW, no relation between FSM and GNP:
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNP_Crescendo_Record_Co
> > >
> > >
> > > Chris L.
> > >
> > >
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> You are correct, sir. But they agree with you. They don't want to compete with the original by doing a remake.
>
>
> From: Zaki Hasan
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 8:46 AM
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [pota] Re: Is no sequel, ever, to POTA2001 an extremely likely scenario?
>
>
>
> Just to be clear, the part quoted below isn't Rick, it's me responding when they ask me what I think.
>
> Zaki
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@> wrote:
>
> As far as a remake, he says: "I'd almost not want to see that. I'd almost prefer that that's just something that's out there that we as the audience know will happen at some point.
>

zauis poster board 68.jpg
zauis poster board 68-66162.jpg
pota - Copy.jpg
pota - Copy-66162.jpg
planet - Copy (8)-66162.jpg

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
>
> Back in 1965 J.Lee was a top director with "The guns of Navarone" and "Cape Fear" and his drinking was under control. His version of Planet might of been very interesting. I agree that Schafner did a great job and no matter what we say its all history now. John M.
>
>
>
> Thompson is also the director of TARAS BULBA, KINGS OF THE SUN, JOHN GOLDFARB, PLEASE COME HOME!, EYE OF THE DEVIL, MACKENNA'S GOLD, and..... well, they're not worth mentioning.
>
> Trust me, just be very glad he didn't direct PLANET.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
>
> Early in this interview, Amanda sez: "What we were trying to do was start with where we are today and see what dominoes would have to fall to get Col. Taylor to that beach 3900 years from now". They consider it an "origin story" leading to the original. A prequel.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-p1qEL3l28
>
>
>
>
> RISE relates to PLANET. RISE doesn't, it seems to me, relate to the sequels. Those are seperate films. If they were doing a prequel to BENEATH, it might be the story of baby Brent or the adventures of Mighty Mendez or something.
>
> Fox has no interest in doing prequels or sequels to BENEATH, ESCAPE, CONQUEST, or BATTLE, nor the Burton debacle. Put those away on the shelf.
>

> And for the love of Caesar, has anyone read Conspiracy?

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, LordTZer0@... wrote:
>
>
> It can be difficult in the spotlight. Just ask The Beatles.
> Kim herself had to yelp once, but only once. They were
> letting people on the set and she was being treated like
> a monkey in a cage, complete with pokes at her muzzle.
> People were understandably curious as to what it felt like,
> with little or no consideration as to how it felt to the person.
>
>
>
> In a message dated 9/19/2011 8:06:18 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> johnroche49@... writes:
>
> Caesar, as played by Rex Harrison.Rex was notorious for being 'difficult'
> and notorious for snapping people's heads off.One night, a fan was waiting
> for him outside a theater for an autograph, when he told her to 'piss
> off'.The fan slapped him and Rex's companion was delighted to report it was 'the
> first time he'd seen the fan hitting the shit'.John, Scrolls.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> FSM is responsible for Beneath and Conquest/Battle. Escape and Planet are from VareseSarabande and the FSM soundtracks will be available till the 3000 copies are exuasted. Beneath I think is gone and you have to buy from second tier sellers. Conquest/Battle is still available. Escape and POTA68 are available. The TV series from Intrada is all gone and commands prices from 50-250 dollars-amazing.
>
> On another subject ,I got the feeling that the writers of Rise were given credit as producers as a deal or compromise or a favor-what a favor. The reel producers are Chernin and company. Take care, John M.
>
>
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "georgetaylor68" <georgetaylor68@> wrote:
> >
> > Is Film Score Monthly's demise going to mean that soundtracks for the Escape from the Planet of the Apes, and Beneath the Planet of the Apes films will no longer be available even at Amazon.com, unless from collectors? I was hoping that Rise's release would boost production and lower the prices. I have all the other Apes soundtracks.
> >
> > Thanks for the info. distinguishing GNP Crescendo, by the way.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, lawford42@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Definitely not good news, but after reading article on the FSM website I
> > > completely understand why. Having been associated with an independent
> > > music label once, I especially understand the paperwork nightmares.
> > >
> > > Still, it's an impressive run of work, and I'm glad I was able to
> > > contribute (in my own small way) to the release of the CONQUEST/BATTLE
> > > score which- in turn- got me a credit in the 'Special Thanks' section.
> > > Between that and facilitating the audio corrections in BENEATH (on the
> > > Blu ray version), it cool to get involved in this stuff.
> > >
> > > BTW, no relation between FSM and GNP:
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNP_Crescendo_Record_Co
> > >
> > >
> > > Chris L.
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Well said Drew!

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@...> wrote:
>
> OK guys-
>
> Honestly, what they say is irrelevant. If you face the facts of the films, RISE is not a prequel, its a different universal timeline, or remake of the entire franchise.
>
> In Rise, the ICARUS leaves in 2010. In the original film, it's clearly stated and shown on the clocks that Taylor and crew left in 1972. Taylor's ship is not even called ICARUS in the actual original films, and has been retconed an official name of LIBERTY-1 as of the Blu-Ray releases, and in my novel, Conspiracy of the Planet of the Apes.
>
> While they likely won't remake the original film, as it is a tough act to follow, they will diverge into their own path that tell an eerily parallel story to the original franchise, but through modern storytelling, and with modern twists to keep us all excited along the way.
>
> Its the same thing the new Star Trek universe will do, but unlike that one, RISE's universe will not clearly state that it is an altered timeline from the first franchise.
>
> Remember what Hasslien said: " One highway with infinite lanes. Change lanes and change your destiny."
>
> And for the love of Caesar, has anyone read Conspiracy?
>
> Drew Gaska
> Author
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> This group has done that and been their. Every few days a subject morphs into another its called progression. If you want to talk about anything then start the subject instead of critiqueing whats their. Thats easy to come in on a train of thought or the hot topic of the moment and kick it down. Relax this place has talked about EVERYTHING about apes and I mean everything. Take care, John M.
>

He already left the group. But no one is forcing anyone to be here. If they are not happy with the topics covered in the thread or other aspects of the group, they are free to leave.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> There's a friggin' POTA movie in theaters. Of course we're going to talk about the box office. I'm tolerant of topics I'm not interested in. If someone can't and wants to be an Urko instead of a curious Cornelius, I say take a hike.
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "jamesa1102" <JamesA1102@...> wrote:
>
>
> He already left the group. But no one is forcing anyone to be here. If
> they are not happy with the topics covered in the thread or other
> aspects of the group, they are free to leave.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@> wrote:
> >
> > There's a friggin' POTA movie in theaters. Of course we're going to
> talk about the box office. I'm tolerant of topics I'm not interested in.
> If someone can't and wants to be an Urko instead of a curious Cornelius,
> I say take a hike.
> >
> >
>

----- Original Message -----
From: Haristas@...
Date: Sunday, September 18, 2011 9:27 pm
Subject: [pota] Remember "Conspiracy"?

> Anybody finish "Conspiracy on the Planet of the Apes" yet?
> Unfortunately, I still haven't made the time to sit down with it.
> I've only gotten to just past page 100, but we know how this is
> going to end -- not good.
>
>

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@...> wrote:
>
> OK guys-
>
> Honestly, what they say is irrelevant. If you face the facts of the films, RISE is not a prequel, its a different universal timeline, or remake of the entire franchise.
>
> In Rise, the ICARUS leaves in 2010. In the original film, it's clearly stated and shown on the clocks that Taylor and crew left in 1972. Taylor's ship is not even called ICARUS in the actual original films, and has been retconed an official name of LIBERTY-1 as of the Blu-Ray releases, and in my novel, Conspiracy of the Planet of the Apes.
>
> While they likely won't remake the original film, as it is a tough act to follow, they will diverge into their own path that tell an eerily parallel story to the original franchise, but through modern storytelling, and with modern twists to keep us all excited along the way.
>
> Its the same thing the new Star Trek universe will do, but unlike that one, RISE's universe will not clearly state that it is an altered timeline from the first franchise.
>
> Remember what Hasslien said: " One highway with infinite lanes. Change lanes and change your destiny."
>
> And for the love of Caesar, has anyone read Conspiracy?
>
> Drew Gaska
> Author
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@> wrote:
> >
> > "I guess, if I had to pick" is not committal.
> > They're obviously flirting with it by having the "Icarus" in it. That suggests either it's a prequel or they want to remake the original. In that interview Jaffa suggests these films will lead up to the original. As far as a remake, he says: "I'd almost not want to see that. I'd almost prefer that that's just something that's out there that we as the audience know will happen at some point...it could lead to apes taking over the planet and, perhaps, getting Col. Taylor on that beach in 3900 years". He doesn't want to compete with the original by doing a remake, so that leaves prequels heading toward the original. Or why would they even bring up "the Icarus" and Col. Taylor?
> > The director has been much more specific and has said "Rise" is a direct prequel to the original.
> >
> >
> > From: jamesa1102
> > Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 2:52 PM
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [pota] Re: Is no sequel, ever, to POTA2001 an extremely likely scenario?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > They were not non-committal. They are asked the direct question: "This has been called a prequel, it's been called a reboot. What would you call it?"
> >
> > To which Rick responds: "I guess, if I had to pick, I would say reboot."
> >
> > Sounds very committal to me.
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@...> wrote:
>
> OK guys-
>
> Honestly, what they say is irrelevant. If you face the facts of the films, RISE is not a prequel, its a different universal timeline, or remake of the entire franchise.
>
> In Rise, the ICARUS leaves in 2010. In the original film, it's clearly stated and shown on the clocks that Taylor and crew left in 1972. Taylor's ship is not even called ICARUS in the actual original films, and has been retconed an official name of LIBERTY-1 as of the Blu-Ray releases, and in my novel, Conspiracy of the Planet of the Apes.
>
> While they likely won't remake the original film, as it is a tough act to follow, they will diverge into their own path that tell an eerily parallel story to the original franchise, but through modern storytelling, and with modern twists to keep us all excited along the way.
>
> Its the same thing the new Star Trek universe will do, but unlike that one, RISE's universe will not clearly state that it is an altered timeline from the first franchise.
>
> Remember what Hasslien said: " One highway with infinite lanes. Change lanes and change your destiny."
>
> And for the love of Caesar, has anyone read Conspiracy?
>
> Drew Gaska
> Author
>
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@> wrote:
> >
> > "I guess, if I had to pick" is not committal.
> > They're obviously flirting with it by having the "Icarus" in it. That suggests either it's a prequel or they want to remake the original. In that interview Jaffa suggests these films will lead up to the original. As far as a remake, he says: "I'd almost not want to see that. I'd almost prefer that that's just something that's out there that we as the audience know will happen at some point...it could lead to apes taking over the planet and, perhaps, getting Col. Taylor on that beach in 3900 years". He doesn't want to compete with the original by doing a remake, so that leaves prequels heading toward the original. Or why would they even bring up "the Icarus" and Col. Taylor?
> > The director has been much more specific and has said "Rise" is a direct prequel to the original.
> >
> >
> > From: jamesa1102
> > Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 2:52 PM
> > To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [pota] Re: Is no sequel, ever, to POTA2001 an extremely likely scenario?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > They were not non-committal. They are asked the direct question: "This has been called a prequel, it's been called a reboot. What would you call it?"
> >
> > To which Rick responds: "I guess, if I had to pick, I would say reboot."
> >
> > Sounds very committal to me.
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@...> wrote:
>
> I've been reading a couple of books on the Nazi invasion of Russia and vice versa (both by Antony Beevor, both brilliant).One passage mentions how the SS used live Russian prisoners for target practice.There's also mention of the famous battle scarred fountain in Stalingrad,with statues of dancing children, very reminiscent of the 'fission-a-fission, we all fall down' dance in Beneath.When you think of Hitler's 'lebensraum' excuse for invading, and maybe think in terms of Zaius as a passive Pope Pius,Beneath really does echo the Russian war--with nuclear armageddon as a sub text.Eric's book discusses this.Beneath, for me, is the most layered and deep of all the Apes movies ( I know that's a big claim)and I wonder what RISE 2 might do to maintain the tradition of thoughtful,powerful commentary on the human disease of war.John, Scrolls.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> I haven't heard anything of a "Project X" remake in the works; there's a movie called "Project X" coming out this year but it's unrelated to the Matthew Broderick chimp movie. I think "Rise" would've taken the steam out of a remake of that.
> There are 5 "Frankenstein" movies in the works, though. With Fox's version in the lead.
> Probably there will be no POTA remakes for awhile since "Rise" has the ball and, as you may have heard, those are prequels.
>
>
> From: georgetaylor68
> Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 3:04 AM
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [pota] King Kong: '33;'76;'05. Project X: '87; '12. POTA1968 remake / reboot: ?
>
>
>
> Amigos:
> Might anyone care to guess what percentage of younger folks whom I've encouraged to see Rise told me that they have never seen POTA1968? It's remarkably high, disappointingly enough. That's especially the case in some other countries like Mexico (where I lived and worked for 6 years, craving the chance to live George Taylor's adventures in a land where we gringos are hated for supposedly taking half of Mexico 1.5 centuries ago).
>
> Anyhow, shouldn't there be a POTA1968 remake / reboot someday? Why should merely King Kong get to benefit from having improved from its 1933 version to its 1976 one and then to the 2005 film? I actually didn't see the 2005 version, but I was told it was for a new generation who hadn't seen the predecessors and who wouldn't, either. (I'm leaving the Godzilla vs. Kong versions out entirely, by the way.)
>
> Yes, the 1968 version of our beloved POTA is vintage and wonderful. But after having seen it over a dozen times, and I know this might sound blasphemous (including to me), the prospect of seeing it again doesn't particularly excite me like it used to. I almost always know what's coming next, and I've thought through nearly all the nuances already, too.
>
> I met with Charlton Heston in 1991 and I think he's the greatest, but our high opinion of William Shatner didn't inspire younger generations to appreciate Star Trek like the reboot did a few years ago, did it? More younger folks might notice POTA1968 if a re-make / reboot stimulates discussion about it. 2 decades ago when Kevin Costner's version of Robin Hood came out, we suddenly started hearing comparisons to the Erol Flynn version which otherwise would have remained all but forgotten.
>
> Fox's Star Wars won't be re-done, but in some ways it's nevertheless being tweaked and improved every few years. The latest version is now on sale as of this month, in fact.
>
> I know we have skeptics here in our beloved group and I concede that Psycho was re-made, frame by frame, and that it bombed commercially (if I'm remembering correctly). I don't advocate that approach for POTA1968. But after seeing Rise, won't folks demand more realistic disguises on apes? Meanwhile, the quasars and such that Taylor saw from the Icarus convince few, if anyone. Same goes for the crash landing, and the rainless lightning / thunder scenes in the forbidden zone.
>
> Friends, please realize that POTA1968 is probably my favorite movie of all time. To me it's as sacred as the scrolls :-) But it particularly bites having to encourage folks to see it and to answer their question regarding which one it is by telling them how it ends. Then what's the point?
>
> ***Spoiler alert: there's an aging statue on the beach and... :-) ***
>
> Seriously though, it doesn't work to say "it's the Charlton Heston version". For one thing, he was in two, make that 3 apes movies. But he's also not been making major Hollywood movies for decades, other than True Lies (in which he briefly appeared with an eyepatch). Who is sufficiently familiar with him among moviegoers? I'd like to cite a statistic that Charlton Heston personally told us at the Virginia Festival of American Film at U.Va. in 1991: the vast majority of moviegoers are under age 25... I.e. True Lies came out when most modern moviegoers were in nursery school. And do you know many younger folks who see The Ten Commandments or Ben Hur with any more attentiveness than we have seen (or slept through) a Humphrey Bogart film? I know, Bogart's no Heston but some older folks might not have agreed with us.
>
> Now then...if you agree that a remake / reboot will eventually be warranted for our beloved 43 year old POTA1968, what modifications would you propose to avoid its being tired and stale for us? I've mentioned make-up and special effects improvements above, with which I'm sure you tend to agree.
>
> Unfortunately POTA2001 snagged the title that a re-make could use, and in some ways it was a reboot that could make a new one get perceived as stale, too. Maybe what we should hope for, then is that the second sequel to Rise feature the return to Earth of the Icarus...while the cartoon's largely forgotten "Return" title be resurrected for it.
>
> I don't have all the answers or better opinions than any of you beloved fellow simian enthusiasts. But isn't even Project X getting a re-make / reboot soon? I think that came out in 1987, decades after POTA1968 was filmed.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
> ¡Ay, caramba! Yeah, this post was pretty much blasphemous.
>
> Why shouldn't there be a POTA1968 remake? You have to ask?!!! Yeah, I guess you do because you don't seem to have... I don't know what? -- a sense of proper respect for great movies. A motion picture that was unique in its time and has endured as a piece of entertainment since, transcends its commercial origins and approaches being a work of art. To so casually call for its remaking simply because to you it seems "too old" or the prospect of seeing it again doesn't "excite you" is like calling for the Mona Lisa to be repainted because the original has to many small cracks in it, or the oil paints of today have so much brighter colors than those from centuries ago.
>
> KING KONG was not "improved" by its remakes. The '76 remake was a travesty, a truly addlebrained piece of rubbish, and the 2005 Peter Jackson version, while not as bad a movie as the '76 remake, was just as goofy and has none of the force nor any of the charm of the original.
>
> There are some things in movies you just don't remake. You don't remake CITIZEN KANE, GONE WITH THE WIND, THE WIZARD OF OZ, and no one had any business remaking KING KONG. PLANET OF THE APES hasn't reached the kind of iconic statue of those movies but it is akin to the 1931 FRANKENSTEIN. Look at how many sequels that movie has had, even one, BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN, that in many ways is a more polished, sophisticated work, and look at how many other Frankenstein movies there have been, and yet even today it's still the '31 version that's best respected and most talked about.
>
> It all comes down to having the sensibilities in yourself to be able to appreciate these things. If some younger people don't have that, then my attitude is, "Too bad for them," but it's not, "Then let's remake it to pander to some philistine love of only things new."
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: georgetaylor68 <georgetaylor68@...>
> To: pota <pota@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:12 am
> Subject: [pota] King Kong: '33;'76;'05. Project X: '87; '12. POTA1968 remake / reboot: ?
>
>
>
>
> Amigos:
> Might anyone care to guess what percentage of younger folks whom I've encouraged to see Rise told me that they have never seen POTA1968? It's remarkably high, disappointingly enough. That's especially the case in some other countries like Mexico (where I lived and worked for 6 years, craving the chance to live George Taylor's adventures in a land where we gringos are hated for supposedly taking half of Mexico 1.5 centuries ago).
>
> Anyhow, shouldn't there be a POTA1968 remake / reboot someday? Why should merely King Kong get to benefit from having improved from its 1933 version to its 1976 one and then to the 2005 film? I actually didn't see the 2005 version, but I was told it was for a new generation who hadn't seen the predecessors and who wouldn't, either. (I'm leaving the Godzilla vs. Kong versions out entirely, by the way.)
>
> Yes, the 1968 version of our beloved POTA is vintage and wonderful. But after having seen it over a dozen times, and I know this might sound blasphemous (including to me), the prospect of seeing it again doesn't particularly excite me like it used to. I almost always know what's coming next, and I've thought through nearly all the nuances already, too.
>
> I met with Charlton Heston in 1991 and I think he's the greatest, but our high opinion of William Shatner didn't inspire younger generations to appreciate Star Trek like the reboot did a few years ago, did it? More younger folks might notice POTA1968 if a re-make / reboot stimulates discussion about it. 2 decades ago when Kevin Costner's version of Robin Hood came out, we suddenly started hearing comparisons to the Erol Flynn version which otherwise would have remained all but forgotten.
>
> Fox's Star Wars won't be re-done, but in some ways it's nevertheless being tweaked and improved every few years. The latest version is now on sale as of this month, in fact.
>
> I know we have skeptics here in our beloved group and I concede that Psycho was re-made, frame by frame, and that it bombed commercially (if I'm remembering correctly). I don't advocate that approach for POTA1968. But after seeing Rise, won't folks demand more realistic disguises on apes? Meanwhile, the quasars and such that Taylor saw from the Icarus convince few, if anyone. Same goes for the crash landing, and the rainless lightning / thunder scenes in the forbidden zone.
>
> Friends, please realize that POTA1968 is probably my favorite movie of all time. To me it's as sacred as the scrolls :-) But it particularly bites having to encourage folks to see it and to answer their question regarding which one it is by telling them how it ends. Then what's the point?
>
> ***Spoiler alert: there's an aging statue on the beach and... :-) ***
>
> Seriously though, it doesn't work to say "it's the Charlton Heston version". For one thing, he was in two, make that 3 apes movies. But he's also not been making major Hollywood movies for decades, other than True Lies (in which he briefly appeared with an eyepatch). Who is sufficiently familiar with him among moviegoers? I'd like to cite a statistic that Charlton Heston personally told us at the Virginia Festival of American Film at U.Va. in 1991: the vast majority of moviegoers are under age 25... I.e. True Lies came out when most modern moviegoers were in nursery school. And do you know many younger folks who see The Ten Commandments or Ben Hur with any more attentiveness than we have seen (or slept through) a Humphrey Bogart film? I know, Bogart's no Heston but some older folks might not have agreed with us.
>
> Now then...if you agree that a remake / reboot will eventually be warranted for our beloved 43 year old POTA1968, what modifications would you propose to avoid its being tired and stale for us? I've mentioned make-up and special effects improvements above, with which I'm sure you tend to agree.
>
> Unfortunately POTA2001 snagged the title that a re-make could use, and in some ways it was a reboot that could make a new one get perceived as stale, too. Maybe what we should hope for, then is that the second sequel to Rise feature the return to Earth of the Icarus...while the cartoon's largely forgotten "Return" title be resurrected for it.
>
> I don't have all the answers or better opinions than any of you beloved fellow simian enthusiasts. But isn't even Project X getting a re-make / reboot soon? I think that came out in 1987, decades after POTA1968 was filmed.
>

planet - Copy (9).jpg
planet - Copy (9)-66194.jpg
planet - Copy (10).jpg
planet - Copy (10)-66194.jpg
beneath - Copy-66194.jpg

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> My wife loves Beneath. I had many parties some years ago and I found young women tend to favor Beneath. Older more mature women love Escape. It probably is the horror element and blood and love of Taylor /Nova , who knows. Its a Dracula thing. I personally like Beneath for its faults. Many different stories or subplots , the Mutants ,the Bomb,an Army film, and like I said its the Horror movie of the Apes to me. Planet is the Political film, Escape the Love story, Conquest the Slavery and oppresion/working class film and Battle the kiddie film-but much better with the extra mutant footage. Take care, John M.
>

large.jpg
large-66203.jpg
large - Copy.jpg
large - Copy-66203.jpg

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, mmuse@... wrote:
>
> Drew,
>
> I've read the book, and I'll give you my positives and negatives:
>
> Positives:
>
> The overall quality of the printed book is an unexpected surprise. The cover and illustrations are top notch.
>
> I think you did a fantastic job of weaving all of the storylines together. I don't see how that could have been done any better. I would guess that this was your primary objective, and you definitely succeeded.
>
> I really enjoyed the way you filled in some of the details of life in Ape City, that is the sort of thing I was looking foward to. The bridge to the residential areas. The family dinner at Marcus' house. The meetings with the President of the Academy. Loved all of that.
>
> Now the negatives (SPOILERS):
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> The telepathic mutants controlling Landon from the ruins of New York City. I don't care for that scenario at all. The telepathy thing ruined BENEATH for me years ago, anyway. The references to the old Marvel brains in a jar. Not my cup of tea.
>
> The overall tone is just too much of a downer. Who do we root for? We all know what's going to happen to Landon, but having Dr. Zaius be such a sadistic bastard that he tortures Landon himself in his office? Galen decapitates captive humans? In what universe would that be a logical scientific procedure? After setting up the back story of Marcus' family, now he's dead? The enemies of the administration in power are thrown into a cave with who knows what? These are not the things I want to associate with Planet of the Apes.
>
> Anyway, just one reader's opinion. I hope you accept it in the spirit intended.
>
> --Mike
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "RonHatter" <ronhatter@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> I finally finished reading it, I thought it was fantastic, Would make a great movie.
>
> I've said in the past that Every Fan has their own take on things, and I belive that is true here, but this is certainly worthy, and it's got Balls, there are some ugly things that happen in this book, but I see it as a Reflection of Humanity, and I think some people have forgotten that aspect of POTA, the Desturbing nature of the matrial is often opressed by centimentality.
>
> But this is just My opnion
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@...> wrote:
>
> Hello Mike and everyone else!
>
> I am a little confused by your statements, and almost feel as though I should not respond, for fear of seeming defensive. I am not, I know I made the right choices for the franchise in this book, but I also hope I can shed some light on them for you (and anyone else reading).
>
> SPOILERS BELOW!
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <
> <<<<The telepathic mutants controlling Landon from the ruins of New York City. I don't care for that scenario at all. The telepathy thing ruined BENEATH for me years ago, anyway. >>>>
>
> You don't like the mutants - but that is part of the mythos, so I really don't understand how that's a negative about my book, the mutants weren't created by me, and have been there since the second film. If you thought I didn't handle them correctly, or that I had them act out of character, I would understand.

>
> <<<<The overall tone is just too much of a downer.>>>>
>
> Let's recap the first four films. We go from mankind having destroyed the human race in ignorance, to the entire world being blown up, to the most likable characters in the series being brutally murdered, to apes taking over the city… I think you can see my point. The apes saga was always a pessimistic one.
>
> <<<<Galen decapitates captive humans? In what universe would that be a logical scientific procedure?>>>>
>
> In our universe. These experiments were done by man on animals. Mankind attached the head and shoulders of one dog to another, making a two-headed dog that lived briefly. We have introduced pigs' blood flow into a decapitated human head to see if we could reanimate it. And, we have beheaded a brain-dead monkey, and put a viable living monkey head on it's body. The new creature lived for three days. Here is a link.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_transplant
>
> These things have been done by man to animals over the centuries, all in the name of science, and al because no one had done them before. These crazy experiments have actually taught us things as well, such as the two-headed dog scenario leading to us being able to do heart transplants.
>
> <<<<Dr. Zaius [is] such a sadistic bastard that he tortures Landon himself in his office.>>>>
>
> Zaius says: "Two young veterinarians under my supervision" completed the surgery. Being the Defender of the Faith, do you really think Zaius would let anyone else interrogate Landon? He even says in the film he will do as much to Taylor. "I will get the answers I seek with surgery".
>
> <<<<After setting up the back-story of Marcus' family, now he's dead?>>>>
>
> Everyone dies at the end of the next movie, and Marcus isn't in the second film. The point here is that Marcus' removal along with compliance from Cerek leads to Ursus getting the control he demonstrates during Beneath.
>
> <<<<The enemies of the administration in power are thrown into a cave with who knows what? These are not the things I want to associate with Planet of the Apes.>>>>
>
> Unfortunately, I fear you may have misinterpreted the premise of the original Planet of the Apes franchise. The apes have always been an allegory of humanity – and while they think they are better than humans, they are actually just a reflection of us. We are the same – we are dark and disturbing creatures who do whatever we think is right to preserve what we think is best.
>
> Again, I hope this didn't come off as defensive, it was intended only to illustrate my choices in crafting this tale. Everyone is entitled to like or not like my work or anyone else's— that is what's great about not living under a totalitarian state. I hope we can stay friends. 8^{)}
>
> -Drew

On Sep 22, 2011, at 9:36 AM, Jeff K. wrote:

 

Here's a comparison boxofficemojo compiled about "Rise" and "similar" films ("X-Men: 1st Class", "G.I. Joe", "Incredible Hulk", "I, Robot" and POTA2001). Mostly it shows how Fox keeps underestimating POTA, since the POTA budgets are much smaller than the other ones yet the POTAs are the overachievers. Maybe now Fox will wake up and spend a little more.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/charts/?id=apesvs.htm

On Thu, Sep 22, 2011 at 9:41 AM, Benjamin Jarrell <ben.jarrell@...> wrote:

Wouldn't you rather that they keep making them on a lower budget, therefore helping to insure that they are successful films? It seems like the higher the cost to produce, the riskier it is. If they can keep making Apes movies that exceed expectations, it seems like sequels would be more likely. If the start costing a much as a big budget hollywood blockbuster, it seems like the expectations from the studios would be much higher. Quality issues aside, isn't that what happened to POTA2001? Even though it made its money back, it didn't make back enough to warrant a sequel.

Ben

On Sep 22, 2011, at 9:36 AM, Jeff K. wrote:

Here's a comparison boxofficemojo compiled about "Rise" and "similar" films ("X-Men: 1st Class", "G.I. Joe", "Incredible Hulk", "I, Robot" and POTA2001). Mostly it shows how Fox keeps underestimating POTA, since the POTA budgets are much smaller than the other ones yet the POTAs are the overachievers. Maybe now Fox will wake up and spend a little more.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/charts/?id=apesvs.htm

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
>
> I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrences in your book.
>
>
>
>
> Some like to think that the lightening flashes in PLANET are being created by the mutants. That really bugs the hell out of me.
>
> As for the character of Dr. Zaius.... even though he is the antagonist (i.e. villain) in PLANET, I don't see him as villainous. He's just an ultra-conservative trying to protect his society. I look at him more as a simian Winston Churchill.
>
> -- Rory
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mmuse <mmuse@...>
> To: pota <pota@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thu, Sep 22, 2011 12:32 pm
> Subject: [pota] Re: Thoughts on Conspiracy (SPOILER ALERT)
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello Drew,
>
> I have no problem with you explaining your approach, and you don't have to worry about offending me, just different points of view. Once again, I would like to reiterate that in my opinion your book was of very high quality overall, and very much appreciated. I just continue to feel that several of the ideas were carried a little too far.
>
> Just to expand on my previous comments, I'll add just a few more thoughts.
>
> I know the telepathic mutants were added in BENEATH, and we just have to accept that. I just think that having them turn Landon into a mute "zombie" is carrying the concept too far. Nothing of that magnitude was shown in BENEATH. I do realize that Brent was forced to strangle Nova for several minutes until he cleared his head, and Taylor and Brent were forced to fight, but I never had the impression that they were unaware of what they were being forced to do, and after the mind control was over, they knew exactly what had happened.
>
> I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrencse in your book.
>
> On the decapitation issue, I can see that man has tried this with dogs and pigs, but Galen wasn't dealing with dogs or pigs. I haven't researched it, but I would doubt that in human history that this sort of thing has ever been attempted with chimps, orangutans, or gorillas, which is the equivalent of what Galen is doing in your book. Head transplants just seem way too much like fictitious horror movie fodder for me personally.
>
> My previous comments on Zaius' actions and Marcus' death are obviously just my personal preferences, and there's nothing more I need to add to that. Your right, of course, everyone dies in the next movie anyway.
>
> I'm definitely waiting for the second book in your series, and hopefully we can share ideas about that one, also.
>
> --Mike
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@> wrote:
> >
> > Hello Mike and everyone else!
> >
> > I am a little confused by your statements, and almost feel as though I should not respond, for fear of seeming defensive. I am not, I know I made the right choices for the franchise in this book, but I also hope I can shed some light on them for you (and anyone else reading).
> >
> > SPOILERS BELOW!
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <
> > <<<<The telepathic mutants controlling Landon from the ruins of New York City. I don't care for that scenario at all. The telepathy thing ruined BENEATH for me years ago, anyway. >>>>
> >
> > You don't like the mutants - but that is part of the mythos, so I really don't understand how that's a negative about my book, the mutants weren't created by me, and have been there since the second film. If you thought I didn't handle them correctly, or that I had them act out of character, I would understand.
>
> >
> > <<<<The overall tone is just too much of a downer.>>>>
> >
> > Let's recap the first four films. We go from mankind having destroyed the human race in ignorance, to the entire world being blown up, to the most likable characters in the series being brutally murdered, to apes taking over the city… I think you can see my point. The apes saga was always a pessimistic one.
> >
> > <<<<Galen decapitates captive humans? In what universe would that be a logical scientific procedure?>>>>
> >
> > In our universe. These experiments were done by man on animals. Mankind attached the head and shoulders of one dog to another, making a two-headed dog that lived briefly. We have introduced pigs' blood flow into a decapitated human head to see if we could reanimate it. And, we have beheaded a brain-dead monkey, and put a viable living monkey head on it's body. The new creature lived for three days. Here is a link.
> >
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_transplant
> >
> > These things have been done by man to animals over the centuries, all in the name of science, and al because no one had done them before. These crazy experiments have actually taught us things as well, such as the two-headed dog scenario leading to us being able to do heart transplants.
> >
> > <<<<Dr. Zaius [is] such a sadistic bastard that he tortures Landon himself in his office.>>>>
> >
> > Zaius says: "Two young veterinarians under my supervision" completed the surgery. Being the Defender of the Faith, do you really think Zaius would let anyone else interrogate Landon? He even says in the film he will do as much to Taylor. "I will get the answers I seek with surgery".
> >
> > <<<<After setting up the back-story of Marcus' family, now he's dead?>>>>
> >
> > Everyone dies at the end of the next movie, and Marcus isn't in the second film. The point here is that Marcus' removal along with compliance from Cerek leads to Ursus getting the control he demonstrates during Beneath.
> >
> > <<<<The enemies of the administration in power are thrown into a cave with who knows what? These are not the things I want to associate with Planet of the Apes.>>>>
> >
> > Unfortunately, I fear you may have misinterpreted the premise of the original Planet of the Apes franchise. The apes have always been an allegory of humanity – and while they think they are better than humans, they are actually just a reflection of us. We are the same – we are dark and disturbing creatures who do whatever we think is right to preserve what we think is best.
> >
> > Again, I hope this didn't come off as defensive, it was intended only to illustrate my choices in crafting this tale. Everyone is entitled to like or not like my work or anyone else's— that is what's great about not living under a totalitarian state. I hope we can stay friends. 8^{)}
> >
> > -Drew
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@...> wrote:
>
> Ironically, as far as I have always been concerned, the lighting was caused by them.
>
> I don't see Zaius as a villain at all - he is protecting his way of life. He is doing what he thinks is best to protect his society and way of life. I don't really believe in black and white, good and evil - so much as I believe in humanity (be they human, vulcan, or ape) and the shades of grey in between. No one twirls their mustache and thinks, "heh, heh - I'll be evil now". Everyone thinks they are right - which is even scarier than thinking they are not...
> Drew
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@ wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrences in your book.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Some like to think that the lightening flashes in PLANET are being created by the mutants. That really bugs the hell out of me.
> >
> > As for the character of Dr. Zaius.... even though he is the antagonist (i.e. villain) in PLANET, I don't see him as villainous. He's just an ultra-conservative trying to protect his society. I look at him more as a simian Winston Churchill.
> >
> > -- Rory
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: mmuse <mmuse@>
> > To: pota <pota@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thu, Sep 22, 2011 12:32 pm
> > Subject: [pota] Re: Thoughts on Conspiracy (SPOILER ALERT)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hello Drew,
> >
> > I have no problem with you explaining your approach, and you don't have to worry about offending me, just different points of view. Once again, I would like to reiterate that in my opinion your book was of very high quality overall, and very much appreciated. I just continue to feel that several of the ideas were carried a little too far.
> >
> > Just to expand on my previous comments, I'll add just a few more thoughts.
> >
> > I know the telepathic mutants were added in BENEATH, and we just have to accept that. I just think that having them turn Landon into a mute "zombie" is carrying the concept too far. Nothing of that magnitude was shown in BENEATH. I do realize that Brent was forced to strangle Nova for several minutes until he cleared his head, and Taylor and Brent were forced to fight, but I never had the impression that they were unaware of what they were being forced to do, and after the mind control was over, they knew exactly what had happened.
> >
> > I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrencse in your book.
> >
> > On the decapitation issue, I can see that man has tried this with dogs and pigs, but Galen wasn't dealing with dogs or pigs. I haven't researched it, but I would doubt that in human history that this sort of thing has ever been attempted with chimps, orangutans, or gorillas, which is the equivalent of what Galen is doing in your book. Head transplants just seem way too much like fictitious horror movie fodder for me personally.
> >
> > My previous comments on Zaius' actions and Marcus' death are obviously just my personal preferences, and there's nothing more I need to add to that. Your right, of course, everyone dies in the next movie anyway.
> >
> > I'm definitely waiting for the second book in your series, and hopefully we can share ideas about that one, also.
> >
> > --Mike
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello Mike and everyone else!
> > >
> > > I am a little confused by your statements, and almost feel as though I should not respond, for fear of seeming defensive. I am not, I know I made the right choices for the franchise in this book, but I also hope I can shed some light on them for you (and anyone else reading).
> > >
> > > SPOILERS BELOW!
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <
> > > <<<<The telepathic mutants controlling Landon from the ruins of New York City. I don't care for that scenario at all. The telepathy thing ruined BENEATH for me years ago, anyway. >>>>
> > >
> > > You don't like the mutants - but that is part of the mythos, so I really don't understand how that's a negative about my book, the mutants weren't created by me, and have been there since the second film. If you thought I didn't handle them correctly, or that I had them act out of character, I would understand.
> >
> > >
> > > <<<<The overall tone is just too much of a downer.>>>>
> > >
> > > Let's recap the first four films. We go from mankind having destroyed the human race in ignorance, to the entire world being blown up, to the most likable characters in the series being brutally murdered, to apes taking over the city… I think you can see my point. The apes saga was always a pessimistic one.
> > >
> > > <<<<Galen decapitates captive humans? In what universe would that be a logical scientific procedure?>>>>
> > >
> > > In our universe. These experiments were done by man on animals. Mankind attached the head and shoulders of one dog to another, making a two-headed dog that lived briefly. We have introduced pigs' blood flow into a decapitated human head to see if we could reanimate it. And, we have beheaded a brain-dead monkey, and put a viable living monkey head on it's body. The new creature lived for three days. Here is a link.
> > >
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_transplant
> > >
> > > These things have been done by man to animals over the centuries, all in the name of science, and al because no one had done them before. These crazy experiments have actually taught us things as well, such as the two-headed dog scenario leading to us being able to do heart transplants.
> > >
> > > <<<<Dr. Zaius [is] such a sadistic bastard that he tortures Landon himself in his office.>>>>
> > >
> > > Zaius says: "Two young veterinarians under my supervision" completed the surgery. Being the Defender of the Faith, do you really think Zaius would let anyone else interrogate Landon? He even says in the film he will do as much to Taylor. "I will get the answers I seek with surgery".
> > >
> > > <<<<After setting up the back-story of Marcus' family, now he's dead?>>>>
> > >
> > > Everyone dies at the end of the next movie, and Marcus isn't in the second film. The point here is that Marcus' removal along with compliance from Cerek leads to Ursus getting the control he demonstrates during Beneath.
> > >
> > > <<<<The enemies of the administration in power are thrown into a cave with who knows what? These are not the things I want to associate with Planet of the Apes.>>>>
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, I fear you may have misinterpreted the premise of the original Planet of the Apes franchise. The apes have always been an allegory of humanity – and while they think they are better than humans, they are actually just a reflection of us. We are the same – we are dark and disturbing creatures who do whatever we think is right to preserve what we think is best.
> > >
> > > Again, I hope this didn't come off as defensive, it was intended only to illustrate my choices in crafting this tale. Everyone is entitled to like or not like my work or anyone else's— that is what's great about not living under a totalitarian state. I hope we can stay friends. 8^{)}
> > >
> > > -Drew
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff K." <veetus@...> wrote:
>
> The POTAs cost about the same: POTA2001 had a $100 million budget, "Rise" $93 million. Those other movies cost a lot more. Given inflation, POTA2001 probably got more for their money. Spending more is no guarantee of quality but it can give a bigger scope and increase the eye candy value that the big smashes seem to have. Maybe fine-tune some of the CG next time.
> Fox tends to go for base hits instead of home runs. They never have the top movie of the year unless they're dealing with a powerful dude like James Cameron or George Lucas who spend more. I'm just saying POTA deserves to have the budgets of the "Batman"s or the "X-Men"s ("First Class" had a $160 million budget and "Rise" did better).
>
>
> From: Benjamin Jarrell
> Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2011 9:41 AM
> To: pota@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [pota] How "Rise" $tacks up
>
>
>
>
> Wouldn't you rather that they keep making them on a lower budget, therefore helping to insure that they are successful films? It seems like the higher the cost to produce, the riskier it is. If they can keep making Apes movies that exceed expectations, it seems like sequels would be more likely. If the start costing a much as a big budget hollywood blockbuster, it seems like the expectations from the studios would be much higher. Quality issues aside, isn't that what happened to POTA2001? Even though it made its money back, it didn't make back enough to warrant a sequel.
>
>
> Ben
>
>
>
> On Sep 22, 2011, at 9:36 AM, Jeff K. wrote:
>
>
>
> Here's a comparison boxofficemojo compiled about "Rise" and "similar" films ("X-Men: 1st Class", "G.I. Joe", "Incredible Hulk", "I, Robot" and POTA2001). Mostly it shows how Fox keeps underestimating POTA, since the POTA budgets are much smaller than the other ones yet the POTAs are the overachievers. Maybe now Fox will wake up and spend a little more.
>
> http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/charts/?id=apesvs.htm
>

TGIF! A new installment of THE MENDEZ DYNASTY is now online.

To read the new MENDEZ biography, click on the banner on the Yahoo Home page or use this link: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/MD.htm.

Have a great weekend everyone!

On Fri, Sep 23, 2011 at 5:17 AM, jamesa1102 <JamesA1102@...> wrote:

TGIF! A new installment of THE MENDEZ DYNASTY is now online.

To read the new MENDEZ biography, click on the banner on the Yahoo Home page or use this link: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/pota/files/MD.htm.

Have a great weekend everyone!

Visit all the Group's special features including:

• The Internal Website - Original POTA One Sheets & Lobby Cards, Trailers & Rare Videos, Trading Cards and much, much more.
• Marvel Archive

- Online archive of Marvel Comics' adaptations of the original POTA movies. Lessons from the Lawgiver – Words of wisdom from the Greatest Ape of All. Cornelius' Journal - The Memoirs of Dr. Cornelius. Ape City Chronicles - The history of Ape City's first 75 years, written by Virgil. POTA Locations - The places where the POTA films were shot. The Art Gallery - Works of POTA Art by our members. The Database Section - POTA info ranging from Characters to Comics. The Photos Section - POTA pics contributed by members.

--

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Will Slay...
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Check out my Audio Drama Productions-
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And the other half of "The Brothers of Kaboom... BY FRACKIN' CROM!
http://brokensea.com/

The Saga of the Grog and Gryphon @
http://brokensea.com/grog/ and
http://www.westlakefilms.co.uk
Planet of the Apes/BPOTA at

http://brokensea.com/pota/
http://brokensea.com/bpota/

and
Ulysses-Galactic Guides & Bounty Hunting
http://brokensea.com/ulysses/ and
CONAN the Audio Book and Audio Drama
http://www.archive.org/details/ConanQueenOftheBlackCoastRobertEHowardFullCastAudio

OTR SwagCast http://brokensea.com/otr/

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "RonHatter" <ronhatter@...> wrote:
>
> Obviously it wasn't intended to be caused by the Mutants when the first film was made, but in hindsite, looking at the films as a whole, then yes the lightning and especially falling rock can conceivably be attributed to the Mutants, so if approched from that point of view, then I personally have no problem buying into it, that has always been my interpretation, Within the context of the Mythology that is.
>
> I'm not really a Big Fan of them controlling Landon, but then again it never occurred to me, so I don't have a problem with it.
>
> But when something is shown from a different "Perspective(in this case literally) then certainly some things will be hard to swallow.
>
> Personally I think My Fan Film would be scrutinized far beyond anything being said about "Conspiracy" But that's do in part to it being a no budget Fan Film(essentially Fan Fiction in Motion so to speak) but probably more due to revisiting important moments in the mythology, not for the sake of rehashing, but because the mythology was shaped by those moments, and showing things from a different perspective from a narrative and visceral standpoint.
>
> but these of course are my own personally opinions, and cant speak for anyone else.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@> wrote:
> >
> > Ironically, as far as I have always been concerned, the lighting was caused by them.
> >
> > I don't see Zaius as a villain at all - he is protecting his way of life. He is doing what he thinks is best to protect his society and way of life. I don't really believe in black and white, good and evil - so much as I believe in humanity (be they human, vulcan, or ape) and the shades of grey in between. No one twirls their mustache and thinks, "heh, heh - I'll be evil now". Everyone thinks they are right - which is even scarier than thinking they are not...
> > Drew
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@ wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrences in your book.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Some like to think that the lightening flashes in PLANET are being created by the mutants. That really bugs the hell out of me.
> > >
> > > As for the character of Dr. Zaius.... even though he is the antagonist (i.e. villain) in PLANET, I don't see him as villainous. He's just an ultra-conservative trying to protect his society. I look at him more as a simian Winston Churchill.
> > >
> > > -- Rory
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: mmuse <mmuse@>
> > > To: pota <pota@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Thu, Sep 22, 2011 12:32 pm
> > > Subject: [pota] Re: Thoughts on Conspiracy (SPOILER ALERT)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello Drew,
> > >
> > > I have no problem with you explaining your approach, and you don't have to worry about offending me, just different points of view. Once again, I would like to reiterate that in my opinion your book was of very high quality overall, and very much appreciated. I just continue to feel that several of the ideas were carried a little too far.
> > >
> > > Just to expand on my previous comments, I'll add just a few more thoughts.
> > >
> > > I know the telepathic mutants were added in BENEATH, and we just have to accept that. I just think that having them turn Landon into a mute "zombie" is carrying the concept too far. Nothing of that magnitude was shown in BENEATH. I do realize that Brent was forced to strangle Nova for several minutes until he cleared his head, and Taylor and Brent were forced to fight, but I never had the impression that they were unaware of what they were being forced to do, and after the mind control was over, they knew exactly what had happened.
> > >
> > > I personally just don't like the idea that the events occurring in PLANET had anything to do with the mutants in BENEATH, which of course affects my opinions about some of the occurrencse in your book.
> > >
> > > On the decapitation issue, I can see that man has tried this with dogs and pigs, but Galen wasn't dealing with dogs or pigs. I haven't researched it, but I would doubt that in human history that this sort of thing has ever been attempted with chimps, orangutans, or gorillas, which is the equivalent of what Galen is doing in your book. Head transplants just seem way too much like fictitious horror movie fodder for me personally.
> > >
> > > My previous comments on Zaius' actions and Marcus' death are obviously just my personal preferences, and there's nothing more I need to add to that. Your right, of course, everyone dies in the next movie anyway.
> > >
> > > I'm definitely waiting for the second book in your series, and hopefully we can share ideas about that one, also.
> > >
> > > --Mike
> > >
> > > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "Blam" <blamventurer@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hello Mike and everyone else!
> > > >
> > > > I am a little confused by your statements, and almost feel as though I should not respond, for fear of seeming defensive. I am not, I know I made the right choices for the franchise in this book, but I also hope I can shed some light on them for you (and anyone else reading).
> > > >
> > > > SPOILERS BELOW!
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <
> > > > <<<<The telepathic mutants controlling Landon from the ruins of New York City. I don't care for that scenario at all. The telepathy thing ruined BENEATH for me years ago, anyway. >>>>
> > > >
> > > > You don't like the mutants - but that is part of the mythos, so I really don't understand how that's a negative about my book, the mutants weren't created by me, and have been there since the second film. If you thought I didn't handle them correctly, or that I had them act out of character, I would understand.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > <<<<The overall tone is just too much of a downer.>>>>
> > > >
> > > > Let's recap the first four films. We go from mankind having destroyed the human race in ignorance, to the entire world being blown up, to the most likable characters in the series being brutally murdered, to apes taking over the city… I think you can see my point. The apes saga was always a pessimistic one.
> > > >
> > > > <<<<Galen decapitates captive humans? In what universe would that be a logical scientific procedure?>>>>
> > > >
> > > > In our universe. These experiments were done by man on animals. Mankind attached the head and shoulders of one dog to another, making a two-headed dog that lived briefly. We have introduced pigs' blood flow into a decapitated human head to see if we could reanimate it. And, we have beheaded a brain-dead monkey, and put a viable living monkey head on it's body. The new creature lived for three days. Here is a link.
> > > >
> > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_transplant
> > > >
> > > > These things have been done by man to animals over the centuries, all in the name of science, and al because no one had done them before. These crazy experiments have actually taught us things as well, such as the two-headed dog scenario leading to us being able to do heart transplants.
> > > >
> > > > <<<<Dr. Zaius [is] such a sadistic bastard that he tortures Landon himself in his office.>>>>
> > > >
> > > > Zaius says: "Two young veterinarians under my supervision" completed the surgery. Being the Defender of the Faith, do you really think Zaius would let anyone else interrogate Landon? He even says in the film he will do as much to Taylor. "I will get the answers I seek with surgery".
> > > >
> > > > <<<<After setting up the back-story of Marcus' family, now he's dead?>>>>
> > > >
> > > > Everyone dies at the end of the next movie, and Marcus isn't in the second film. The point here is that Marcus' removal along with compliance from Cerek leads to Ursus getting the control he demonstrates during Beneath.
> > > >
> > > > <<<<The enemies of the administration in power are thrown into a cave with who knows what? These are not the things I want to associate with Planet of the Apes.>>>>
> > > >
> > > > Unfortunately, I fear you may have misinterpreted the premise of the original Planet of the Apes franchise. The apes have always been an allegory of humanity – and while they think they are better than humans, they are actually just a reflection of us. We are the same – we are dark and disturbing creatures who do whatever we think is right to preserve what we think is best.
> > > >
> > > > Again, I hope this didn't come off as defensive, it was intended only to illustrate my choices in crafting this tale. Everyone is entitled to like or not like my work or anyone else's— that is what's great about not living under a totalitarian state. I hope we can stay friends. 8^{)}
> > > >
> > > > -Drew
> > >
> >
>

>Personally I think My Fan Film would be scrutinized far beyond anything being said about "Conspiracy" But that's do in part to it being a no budget Fan Film(essentially Fan Fiction in Motion so to speak) but probably more due to revisiting important moments in the mythology, not for the sake of rehashing, but because the mythology was shaped by those moments, and showing things from a different perspective from a narrative and visceral standpoint.

Probably the same reasons why scenes of Taylor, Dodge and Landon in the Forbidden Zone, Taylor's escape and Zira, Lucius & the Gorillas on the causeway weren't in the final cut of Planet.

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
> Found this info on the IMDb.com message board. Why wasn't this stuff in the final film?!!!
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "dave" <smugster2000@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Robert,
>
> I haven't made any comment about your project until now because it's been like trying to judge the quality of a novel from one paragraph. All I can say is that I'm intrigued by what I've seen and I'm very much looking forward to being able to watch the whole thing from beginning to end.
>
> I know these things take a ungodly amount of time and I can't begin to imagine how many hours you've already spent on this. So keep at it, give it the best you can and never waver from what YOU want it to be.
>
> Any eta for all that? :0)
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
> >Personally I think My Fan Film would be scrutinized far beyond anything being said about "Conspiracy" But that's do in part to it being a no budget Fan Film(essentially Fan Fiction in Motion so to speak) but probably more due to revisiting important moments in the mythology, not for the sake of rehashing, but because the mythology was shaped by those moments, and showing things from a different perspective from a narrative and visceral standpoint.
>

>>Thats cool that you were part of the Conquest/Battle soundtracks.

>>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, lawford42@... wrote:
>
> The unusual source for the BENEATH audio EFX has been detailed in the
> group here previously, though I can't remember now if it was Spain or
> somewhere else. Who here can clarify?
>
> I wasn't even aware that HBO/Max had the corrected audio versions. I
> remember watching them several years ago on ActionMax, and it seems to me
> the problems were still there. In fact, I can't remember the last time I
> saw the film broadcast on TV where the audio for BENEATH was correct.
>
> What elements from the chimp protest scene are still missing? The stuff
> for the Blu ray release was matched up with what was on the original
> Magnetic Video release from 1978 (the ONLY home video release that had
> the correct audio soundtrack until the Blu ray came out), and as far as I
> knew everything was fixed.
>
> One minor correction: "Between that and facilitating the audio
> corrections in BENEATH (on the Blu ray version), it cool to get involved
> in this stuff"
>
> Should have read: "...it was cool to be able to get involved in this
> stuff".
>
>
> Chris L.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
>
>
> I think Fox will play it safe and only commit to just one sequel for now, which doesn't mean they won't have plans for a third, but they'll only commit to one, will increase the budget on it over the $93 Mill spent on RISE, and then will wait and see how the next one does.
>
> The next APES film will have to be bigger than the last one in order to excite the public, and will therefore be more complicated to make, which is why I think it'll be something like three years before it comes out. Behind that I haven't a clue, but I'm pretty sure Fox does not want to start cranking out APES films like they did in the early '70s.
>
> Meanwhile, I'm just becoming more and more impatient for the Blu-ray of RISE.
>
> -- Rory
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> I go either way when it comes to budgets. More money would be great but we all seen that it means nothing without a great script. Lets say they do make two sequels, the story arc seems to demand atleast one big film. Who knows, but its fun speculating, but we are not going to live forever. Look at the Terminator films, 1984 - 2010 and beyond? Over 26 years atleast oy!, John M.
>

misc_planet_of_the_apes_study_guide_b_JM02686_L.jpg
misc_planet_of_the_apes_study_guide_b_JM02686_L-66246.jpg
1311109490.jpg
1311109490-66246.jpg

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "georgetaylor68" <georgetaylor68@...> wrote:
>
> Both Avatar AND Apes fans will likely be interested to know that Fox is giving science fiction fans a new "Commander Taylor" this week :-)
>
> http://www.fox.com/terranova/videos/1208242/the-legend-of-nathaniel-taylor
>
> Hopefully he won't get within touching range of an Alpha-Omega bomb control panel AND get shot up yet promptly shirked by a prominent orangutan in the same moment...
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@...> wrote:
>
> It was Spain.
> - Scott B.
>
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@...> wrote:
>
> Patrick Doyle's RISE score gets 4 out of 5 stars in this month's Total Film---desevedly so, imho, as it's an excellent accompaniment to an excellent film! John, Scrolls.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@> wrote:
> >
> > It was Spain.
> > - Scott B.
> >
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@...> wrote:
>
> Don't know if this has been covered already, so I make no apologies if I'm being a tit in public, but the THOR and the CAPTAIN AMERICA discs are going to have mini movies in them, featuring the Agent Coulson character.I was wondering if ,maybe, the 'Apocalypse' thing on the RISE disc will actually be a mini movie? And I'm still heart broken at the lack of novels, trading cards and action figures--there's an enormous void of a nerd-hole in my life that needs filling.That used to be my chat up line.John, Scrolls.
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> I like the score very much but to me its not up to the original series(Aleast 1-4) in originality and just great music writing. The original films got me going into music seriously back in the late 60s and early 70s and I play Piano Oboe and Sax. If I were to break it down Piano/Oboe from POTA68 and Sax from Conquest, but I dont think my mind worked that way, I had so many influences.
> The score is good but their is nothing memorable about any cue ,but that is more a sign of the times than Rises fault. They just dont write them them like they used to. Could you imagine half the tv series and made for TV films and movies without the aura of writers like Lalo , Jerry, Domonic Fronteire and so so many others . Their music alone was THE movie.
> Im just a product of my time I guess so thats my problem, anyway Rises scor is a good score and better than just servicable to the film. Take care, John M.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@> wrote:
> >
> > Patrick Doyle's RISE score gets 4 out of 5 stars in this month's Total Film---desevedly so, imho, as it's an excellent accompaniment to an excellent film! John, Scrolls.
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, scott bosco <digitalcinema@> wrote:
> > >
> > > It was Spain.
> > > - Scott B.
> > >
> > >
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@...> wrote:
>
> You will get all the toys and extras with a sucsessfull sequel, youll see. Your friend, John M. PS, I know its not 1968 but other than a novel and trading cards and Gold Key comic for Beneath in 70, nothing was done with Apes until the GO APE campaigne in73-74...
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@> wrote:
> >
> > Don't know if this has been covered already, so I make no apologies if I'm being a tit in public, but the THOR and the CAPTAIN AMERICA discs are going to have mini movies in them, featuring the Agent Coulson character.I was wondering if ,maybe, the 'Apocalypse' thing on the RISE disc will actually be a mini movie? And I'm still heart broken at the lack of novels, trading cards and action figures--there's an enormous void of a nerd-hole in my life that needs filling.That used to be my chat up line.John, Scrolls.
> >
>

--- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@...> wrote:
>
> You promise? Honest? If I had a guarantee, I could live with waiting!!!! John, Scrolls.
>
> --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "JohnM conquest-idor" <johnmermigas@> wrote:
> >
> > You will get all the toys and extras with a sucsessfull sequel, youll see. Your friend, John M. PS, I know its not 1968 but other than a novel and trading cards and Gold Key comic for Beneath in 70, nothing was done with Apes until the GO APE campaigne in73-74...
> >
> > --- In pota@yahoogroups.com, "johnroche49" <johnroche49@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Don't know if this has been covered already, so I make no apologies if I'm being a tit in public, but the THOR and the CAPTAIN AMERICA discs are going to have mini movies in them, featuring the Agent Coulson character.I was wondering if ,maybe, the 'Apocalypse' thing on the RISE disc will actually be a mini movie? And I'm still heart broken at the lack of novels, trading cards and action figures--there's an enormous void of a nerd-hole in my life that needs filling.That used to be my chat up line.John, Scrolls.
> > >
> >
>