I offered to just buy POTA but they laughed at me. : (

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I remember with Rise and Dawn they seemed to be over in Japan and then there'd be a last minute dump of money as the final tally came in. Might still happen with War ($4 million seems kinda low) but doubtful now it will reach $500 million.

Doesn't really matter, any way you slice it it's a disappointment. Maybe too much of a downer but brave of Fox to do it.

The way forward (if Fox doesn't get sold) is maybe cut the budget to $100 million, concentrate more on the downtrodden humans and less on the expensive apes. And make a more entertaining picture that will get that box office back up there. Entertaining doesn't mean dumbed down.

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At this point I'd say there's little chance of Fox being sold. AT&T is having trouble getting their Time/Warner purchase to go through. Meanwhile, it's business as usual at Fox so likely they are figuring out the next Apes.

deadline.com/2017/11/att-time-warner-merger-concerns-justice-department-fox-delay-1202211167/

Loved the new "Battlestar Galactica". As I've said here before, the producer Ron Moore is an Apes fan who put many references in the show. The actor who played Gaeta played Spear in "War". The helicopter pilot in "Rise" made many BSG appearances.

The new BSG feature film (no relation to the series) is being produced for Universal by Dylan (Rise/Dawn/War) Clark. And Apes may join it if Comcast (owner of Universal) buys Fox.

The BSG spinoffs were "Caprica" and a pilot called "Blood and Chrome" (on video).

"Blade Runner" is outa here but the director is doing "Dune", which will also flop because nobody bothers going to serious sci-fi.

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I should of said it doesn't HAVE to be dumbed down.

There's plenty of smart, entertaining movies.

But most movies are dumbed down because people are dumbed down.

By the way, Many people see the POTA concept as a "dumb, campy" idea. Their loss.

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From what I understand, the Murdochs are pretty hands off on their movies. They have final say but it's mostly the studio heads that mold the films. And they've got a pretty good team now (POTA, "Logan").

Unfortunately audiences don't reward innovation, so they'll have to be more cookie cutter like Disney.

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Being released earlier doesn't stop people from watching/discussing "War" during Thanksgiving – but it's no turkey!

Yes, POTA merchandise is dead in the water. Unless Disney buys Fox and we get cuddly, huggable Dr. Zaiuses.

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The holidaze are upon us and this Caesar ice sculpture in London (congrats, Prince Harry!) is apeon us.

twitter.com/firstshowing/status/935192149620076545

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Yikes, if only it was more "lollipops and rainbows" it might have done better at the box office.

Hard to say the apes weren't bitter given what Koba and crew were up to in "Dawn". And even Caesar was turned into a killing machine in "War". All he wanted was to get a Woody.

In the end an expensive movie needs someone to root for and the apes were the heroes in this (like in Escape, Conquest and Battle). I'm sure it's time for the apes to be the big bad and humans the heroes.

As for the avalanche, Matt Reeves said in the commentary that this was his Moses story and the avalanche was his parting of the Red Sea. Maybe too on the nose about the human era being over but a nice metaphor: the apes survived it because they were apes and could climb trees. It reminded me of the Boulle novel where I think it was Zira explaining why apes became top banana. Because they could use all four limbs and understand the dimensions of space. Something like that.

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Last night I went to a screening of "War For the POTA" with a Q & A of the director Matt Reeves. It was a Jeff Goldsmith screening which means it was a low key groovy event. There was like 20 people there so I got to ask what I want. By the way, Jeff Goldsmith Q & A's are awesome so when this becomes available I will let you know.

To the point: I asked Matt about the box office and whether Fox wants to consider more Apes with the drop from "Dawn" to "War". He sez "War" made a profit and Fox is still enthusiastic. (for those who think Reeves is lying because he directed "War", I was there and believe him; he's a serious guy). He also said he doesn't know about any future movies but maybe they will wait for him. He definitely wants to do more Apes. He is a true believer. BUT with Batman on his dance card maybe for the next decade that might not be a good idea. His Batman might flop and he could go back to Apes soonish but I doubt it. Call Oliver Stone.

I also asked him my big question about the movie: Where do the apes end up? As far as Reeves is concerned it's an open question but he assumes they are in Nevada (most of the movie taking place in California).

Those were my questions and for asking them I received an awesome "War" poster personalized by Matt. He also added his sig to my Eric Greene book (between Heston and Oliver Stone). Reeves is as friendly and full of stamina as you'd want. His plate is full but he was graceful to everyone.

As far as the rest of the lengthy Q & A (which I will announce when it's up) he said they toyed with the idea of Maurice being the Lawgiver (literally like in "Battle" where you hear his voice in the beginning and at the end you know who it is). The thing about Goldsmith's Q & A is it's writer centric so there's lots of gems about the creative process.

Another thing that stood out: Fox was high on Reeves and while he was finishing "Dawn" they asked him to do "War". So when they started "War" he and his co-writer Mark Bombeck (who is also giving his opinion on Batman) asked Fox to let them watch some movies together as inspiration. Fox let them use the Zanuck Theater. Reeves' dad worked in the industry and Reeves got to see the original "Star Wars" at the Zanuck Theater in 1977 before it was released (of course now his lifetime pal and collaborator J. J. Abrams is literally working on the new "Star Wars" movies – talk about surreal!). Anyway, they could use the Zanuck theater but watch the movies on blu-ray. BUT Fox said they could watch ONE movie in it's original print. So they chose "The Empire Strikes Back". Reeves assumed "Dawn" would be their "Empire" (a dark middle chapter) but now he sees "War" that way.

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Thanx Hunter for all you do.

My last Goldsmith Q & A was for "Rise" (with Rick Jaffa and Amanda Silver) 6 years ago. It feels full circle, the beginning and the end (as Woody's people might say). I did a transcript for that (Dec. 2011) and I might for this as well. It really does get into the nitty gritty of the script. It's not "what was it like working with Andy Serkis?".

The Jaffa one was incredible and showed how they nursed "Rise" for years. Without them these new movies just wouldn't have happened. Fans groan that Boulle doesn't get credit in these new ones and that complaint is legit. But the Jaffas deserve their "created by" and producer credit.

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Yeah, I gave the link for that podcast. It's Jeff Goldsmith's.

theqandapodcast.com/2011/12/rise-of-planet-apes-q.html

Here's the one for "Dawn" I haven't even listened to yet.

theqandapodcast.com/2014/08/matt-reeves-dawn-of-planet-of-apes-q.html

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This thread shows the scene last night and the kind of guy Matt Reeves is.

twitter.com/SunflowerJD/status/935684334802976768

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He reiterated that it can't be the same timeline because the virus wuz the culprit, not nukes.

Doesn't matter, he's gone for now. The next director could introduce nukes.

Fun fact: Oliver Stone recently watched "Dr. Strangelove" with Putin (hint, hint).

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As they stand right now I think Nu Apes can be enjoyed either way. On their own (meaningless, my ass! Fans, appreciate these because they are miracles) or they are early enough in the story to connect to the original if you want to. If, like Haristas and me, you see the originals as two timeline (Planet/Beneath and Escape/Conquest/Battle) then Rise/Dawn/War could fit in the early days of the original (with minor contradictions). The nukes haven't hit yet.

If you're a circularist who sees Escape leading to Beneath it doesn't work of course, which I think is how Matt Reeves sees it, two separate origin stories. But if you believe Cornelius and Zira changed history by going back (which jives with modern physics) then Rise and Co. could be the origin of the world Taylor finds (Taylor having come from a separate timeline, why he left long before "Rise" takes place.

Look at it however you want and enjoy these new movies which are damn good.

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Oliver Stone adding nukes to POTA - $12 million

Oliver Stone making the apes look more like the makeup in the original - $54 million

Haristas and Matt Reeves going fishing together - priceless

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I'm getting at that if you want Rise/Dawn/War to lead to the original ("Besides, man is a nuisance. He migrates to our green belts and ravages our crops") you can.

Doesn't matter what Matt Reeves sez, he hasn't looked deep into his own soul. Just as it doesn't matter that Paul Dehn said Escape leads to Planet.

It's what you the viewer wants, baby.

If Cornelius and Zira go to another timeline and Taylor is from that timeline, who do we hurt?

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COUGAR: So you're saying I can accept Rise/Dawn/War as part of the original POTA timeline?

THERAPIST: Yes. Gift yourself!

COUGAR: It feels unnatural… But I'll do it!

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I'd say it's funny because you wouldn't say that. From your posts it's obvious you wouldn't say that.

Just being a comedian.

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Word is that Disney is still negotiating for Fox so POTA might have a new home before the year is out.

Comcast (which owns Universal Pictures) is also a suitor (I'd prefer them because they are not so family friendly).

Meanwhile Cornelius is holding Zira close…

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According to CNBC this deal could be announced next week, the perfect Christmas gift for the studio that has everything (Disney). Basically Disney would get the entertainment assets (valued at $60 billion +) and Fox would keep "FOX", the news and sports stuff. Though it would no longer have the movie studio for which it wuz named.

collider.com/disney-fox-deal/

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