I keep forgetting to ask you what you thought of BATMAN RETURNS!

I mean – that WAS well written, executed…..EVERYTHING!  That was the sort of remake POTA DESERVED!

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ty Templeton
Sent: Friday, 9 December 2005 4:15 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Copyrights on the POTA

I've said it before and I'll say it again. 

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE Thade, but didn't love the movie around him.  I enjoy watching the movie with the sound off (which improves it enormously) because it's a feast for the eyes if not the brain, but I fast forward through any scene with Kristofferson and with Bonham Carter, since they were both terrible.  The gorilla played by Michael Clarke Duncan was also interesting, and Giamatti's "Limbo" stole every scene he was in. And Glenn Shadix's Senator Nado is wonderful in the dinner party...(I've loved Shadix in Beetlejuice and Heathers). There were so many good parts to the recent movie, it just adds to the disappointment I feel that it could have been SO much better, if only it had a script...but the writing is merely one aspect of the film, and there was much to admire in it, failed attempt though it was.  It's much like Burton's Batman movies, which I "get" are fun movies, but I spend most of my time pissed off that they're not better written.

And someone mentioned to me recently that Mark Wahlberg is in the movie somewhere...did any of you guys know that?   I've never noticed him.  Is he one of the humans or something?  I can't for the life of me remember what scene he's in....

Ty the Guy.

PS:  Heston rocks, though his makeup was the only one that sucked, for some reason.

That ONE thing would have been WORTH IT!!  J

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ty Templeton
Sent: Friday, 9 December 2005 4:22 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Copyrights on the POTA

and no, I never intended the Mr. Comics series to use the Burton continuity...not at all.  Joe and I had written a plot that involved Caesar and Thade basically having a war.  We'd come up with some interesting ways of merging the two storylines (which are not mutually exclusive at all) and there was some lovely stuff in our original plot, which I still maintain was interesting.

And just for purists...in our original pitch....Caesar won the war, and killed Thade.

No – that means we can call it a comedy and move on!  J

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of LordTZer0@...
Sent: Friday, 9 December 2005 5:45 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Copyrights on the POTA

I think he was being sarcastic Cougar…..

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Friday, 9 December 2005 2:15 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: Planet of the Apes Super-8 films...

In a message dated 12/8/2005 7:43:48 PM Central Standard Time, DrZaiusDavis@... writes:

You fanboys kill me.

Aren't you though an ULTIMATE "fan boy"? I mean arms covered with MUPPETS, how much more "fan boy" can you get?

Say PLEASE!!!  J

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Friday, 9 December 2005 2:48 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: Domo arigato Neil's crazy roboto

In a message dated 12/8/2005 9:37:54 PM Central Standard Time, whitty@... writes:

Elaine – he even said “please”! 

Whitty,

You need to edit down the parts you're replying to too... :)

Hi Chris and thanks but I’m not about to go putting these on paper!  I believe there’s and 800 pound gorilla who owns the license for such things and I have heard such animals are best behaved when you don’t go out of your way to piss them off!

And I believe your opinion will change in a couple of weeks when you see Revolution……actually I’m sure it will because I’ve seen a preview and it blew me away (and the rumour is true – I’m ALWAYS right!).  You can tell the writers have done their homework and the art is great.  I must admit I was equally impressed with the Back-Story.  I don’t know who illustrated it but I would seriously like to see whoever it was do a graphic novel of Boulle…and the story (I only recently realised Ty wrote this himself) is fantastic.  A particular element of story-telling I love (and have since reading Kings Bachmann books) is the tying in of other elements…threading….meeting seemingly unimportant characters who turn out to be critical to the story.

As we did with “Beware the Beast”, we will be printing a small run of WITHIN so we can show them to prospective publishers (including newspapers for WITHIN because it is in STRIP format).  I won’t sell them, but I will allow interested parties to pay print/postage costs and get their hands on a copy.

The latest on “Beware the Beast” is that I was told (by Platinum Comics) it needs a re-write……apparently the script jumps from first-person to third-person and it was decided that a lot of the text is just unnecessary because the art tells the story and the text becomes distracting.  I can sorta see the point but we were also told that, in all honesty, the appeal of publishing BTB is very limited – POTA is not an enormous market and it has appeal mostly for fans.  It is not coloured (as is almost expected of a comic these days) and it is cerebral…..not enough action.  Everyone who has seen it, including a hell of a lot of “non-fans” (and my wife who is an “anti-fan” and HATES POTA!) is blown away by the art.  But should we go back and re-write it, colour it and try to get it published?  Hmmm…..don’t think so!

I know the Australian X-Files Fan Club obtained special licenses to produce VERY limited comics and novels (and even a VHS Tape I think?!?!?!).  I believe they paid all costs and then paid the licensee a percentage for each comic sold – and they could only produce 1000.  I am looking into this – I have asked Debbie at Fox (who does POTA Licensing) and she’s looking into it.  This looks like the best possible way I could get these into print – by paying out plenty for costs and risking losing money.  I’d probably be insane enough to do it too.  J

The first issue of GOING HOME is finished.  The last pages are pencilled and need inking (or colouring…..I think I just heard Neil faint!) and text needs to be added.  There DOES seem to still be a market in the UK for the TV show.  The objective is to change the old characters to more interesting people, maybe kill some off, and get into a fantastic battle between humans and apes, drop the fugitive theme, and introduce lead characters who are interesting…not flat and predictable and one dimensional.  Characters more like Nancy Botwin in WEEDS, Denny Crane and Alan Shore in Boston Legal, and possibly more like the girls from Sex and the City.  If this does transform we can give closure to old fans, draw new fans, and actually transform the TV Show medium to something HBO, Showtime, or the Sci-Fi Channel (or even the Cartoon Network!) might want to invest into developing a 10 episode show from.  But that’s the BIGGER picture…. J 

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Hight
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 3:45 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Within the Planet of the Apes strip #37

Excellent job. By far this is the best Apes comic to have ever been produced. Keep them coming. Maybe you could put the past strips into Simian Scrolls? The internet is fine but I want to be able to sit on my couch and read them with my feet up.

Just kidding….

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of taebokitti@...
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 4:18 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: Domo arigato Neil's crazy roboto

Savoury biscuits…or water crackers…..

 

Now let me get back to my breakfast of kangaroo testicles!  ;)

 

 

 

Kangaroo testicles? Elaine

I think it might have had some deep message there we missed….a particular reason for a ship with a (solar) sail and the message in the bottle….

Hey Neil, show us your Solar Sail!

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of taebokitti@...
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 4:33 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Boulle's ending

Elaine

Reaching for my dictionary as we speak!

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of taebokitti@...
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 4:35 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: Domo arigato Neil's crazy roboto

I can't promise anything, after reading your post about eating kangaroo testicles, I'm a little discombobulated right now. Elaine 

Yup!  That was just downright misleading! 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 4:50 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Copyrights on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> And then the bastards released "Monkey Planet"!  I bought it for $25
in
> Sydney while I was on vacation and rushed through a crowd of
prostitutes
> back to my hotel room to rip it out of the paper bag...and find it
was
> just the first 4 (cruddy!) Adventure Comics stories!
>
> Michael
    


   You just won't let this  lie :) I reckon some one owes you $25,
possibly the copy right holders :)
Best Graham.

Whaddaya paintin’?

Share?

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 4:50 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Copyrights on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> And then the bastards released "Monkey Planet"!  I bought it for $25
in
> Sydney while I was on vacation and rushed through a crowd of
prostitutes
> back to my hotel room to rip it out of the paper bag...and find it
was
> just the first 4 (cruddy!) Adventure Comics stories!
>
> Michael
    


   You just won't let this  lie :) I reckon some one owes you $25,
possibly the copy right holders :)
Best Graham.

Who was that?

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 9:27 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Sour Grapes on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Yup!  That was just downright misleading! 
  



  Yeah, I have too agree !! Comic publishers don't you just
love 'em :) Still I don't think Adventure comics had any connection to
the mafia like some publishers allegedly had.
Best Graham

Does Pete have his shirt on?!?!  J

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 9:41 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Copyrights on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Whaddaya paintin'?
> 
> Share?
> 
   More Tv portraits, got a couple on the go at the moment. I've
become totally fixated on a pic of Virdon and really can't see the
wood for the trees. At the moment that ones sitting around with great
big blobs of oil paint slowly drying and I've just started a larger
pic of Burke (Too big for the scanner,I'll have to take a photo
instead ). The idea being that the larger size will free up the work a
little.
Best Graham.

Crikey!  Ty, do you know what you are getting yourself into!?!?  :-o

Oh man, we could do some serious fiction re why “REVOLUTION” is delayed! J

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 10:23 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Sour Grapes on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Who was that?



   I'd be tempted to say take your pick :) but one of the original
owners of DC comics Harry Donenfeld had connections with New York
gangster Frank Costello. The early days of comic publishing is still
pretty murky. Harry's son Irwin when asked ,just a couple of years
before he died, about his family connection with organised crime he
apparantly said "put it this way Frank Costello was my God father "
and laughed. Donenfeld made his early money in pulps, printing,and
with his partner Jack Liebowitz owned Independent News disributors
the company that pretty much ended up with a strangle hold on
distributing mags and comics in the states. (Lots of truck space in
bootleg America ) Liebowitz who by the 60's was much more the public
face of the company started out as an accountant for trade unions.
The above is just off the top of my head but there's a really good
book called Men of Tomorrow (subtitled Geeks Gangsters and the birth
of the comic book.)by Gerard Jones which covers some of this.
Charlton comics always had persistent rumours of Mafia connections
but I don't think any ones come up with any evidence. I mean the two
owners only met in prison :)
Best Graham.

Oooohhh !!  Dreamy!!!

Geez I’m gonna be unpopular when I…………

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hill19652000
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 10:26 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Copyrights on the POTA

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Does Pete have his shirt on?!?!  :-)
>
> Michael
 
Yeah, but he's got one of his smouldering stares :)
Best Graham.

Bloody hell!  It just occurred to me (whilst watching Black Adder 2) that George is Hugh Laurie!!!!!  SHIT!

What an actor!

And what a guy – that House character!

Michael

I’d sure like to see something visual.

Neil, I know you did some illustrations…mind sharing?

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Haristas@...
Sent: Saturday, 10 December 2005 11:31 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Boulle's ending

In a message dated 12/9/05 12:44:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, taebokitti@... writes:

The original novel was a satire of the human race not an action adventure story. The ending of finding the message in a bottle was appropiate for the book but wouldn't be as effective in a movie. The ending of the first film is probably the greatest ending to a film in movie history.

Elaine

I like the novel as much as the film and I think a fairly literal adaptation of the book could be done for a film, and would be good.  A few minor changes, but basically Boulle's scenario is sound -- and creepier than the '68 version.

-- Rory

Hey Neil,

You drunk enough for me to ask you to load the latest WITHIN yet?  ;)

Michael

I thought I had dropped enough hints but obviously not!  J

I wanted to set it 7-10 years prior.

Milo is a very mysterious character to me – much like some are fascinated with James Dean, Cobain and others who are brilliant at what they do but die young, I wanted to create a past for Milo that would help us understand how he could be so committed as to do what it takes to get into the pilot seat.

I think most interesting people are not perfect and I have always preferred the anti-hero to the hero wearing a white hat (one dimensional good guy).

I think Milo is rather bitter and twisted from guilt and the terrible burden of living a lie.

Well, makes him more interesting to me!  J

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Greg Plonowski
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 10:49 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] New WITHIN!?!?!?

Hey Neil,

 

You drunk enough for me to ask you to load the latest WITHIN yet?  ;)

Michael

Oh – and THANKS Greg!  You are a legend!

Anybody else here want an invite to join the PHOTOS group so you can read WITHIN all the way through?

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Greg Plonowski
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 10:49 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] New WITHIN!?!?!?

Hey Neil,

 

You drunk enough for me to ask you to load the latest WITHIN yet?  ;)

Michael

Cool……

OK – I’m guessing it is around 7pm on Saturday in many parts of the USA – would that be right?!?!?!

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Neil
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 11:22 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: New WITHIN!?!?!?

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
> Hey Neil,
> 
> You drunk enough for me to ask you to load the latest WITHIN yet?  ;)

-- Drunk enough? At 9.30am!?! Come on I'm not that bad!

I do have a few urgent things to get done right now but I'll have a go
at uploading it later today (after I have sobered up.) ;-)

Neil

Just sent an invite

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lazy Red Ace
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 11:42 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] New WITHIN!?!?!?

Sure, how can I join?

RedAce^



On Sun, 11 Dec 2005 11:21:29 +1100, you wrote:

>Oh - and THANKS Greg!  You are a legend!
>
>Anybody else here want an invite to join the PHOTOS group so you can
>read WITHIN all the way through?
>
>Michael
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
>Of Greg Plonowski
>Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 10:49 AM
>To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [PotaDG] New WITHIN!?!?!?
>
>Well, I just uploaded the PDF of the last 12 strips (61 through 72) in
>the photos group. So those who wait for the PDFs to print out and read
>can go get them there.
>
>http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDiscussionGroupphotos/files
>
>I found this last page very interesting. All along I'd been assuming
>this story took place either just prior to Planet or between Planet and
>Beneath. Now we learn it's several years prior to Planet, which gives
>Milo plenty of time to learn about the ship.
>
>Greg
>
>Michael Whitty <whitty@...> wrote:
>Hey Neil,
>
>You drunk enough for me to ask you to load the latest WITHIN yet?  ;)
>
>Michael
>
>--

Oh fiddlesticks!

This sounds way too much like Fry (in Futurama) being his own dad…..entertaining and amusing but hardly plausible!  J  10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5…….

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:08 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...and MORE new WITHIN!?!??!

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil" <nfoster@h...> wrote:
>
> --- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Tilton
> <patrickmichaeltilton@y...> wrote:
> >The crux of the matter is: if the Doomsday Bomb
> DOESN'T explode in 3955, then how can the Ape-onauts
> exist in the 1973+ Timeline? CAUSE and EFFECT: the
> explosion CAUSED the Timewarp that sent the Ape-onauts
> back in time from 3955 to 1973. Their arrival in 1973
> is the EFFECT of that CAUSE. Caesar CAN'T change that
> future, because he'd be erasing his own existence. His
> very existence is proof positive that NO ONE can alter
> that particular future.
>
> -- Sounds right to me.
>
> Neil

*** Damn straight! They didn't ERASE a timeline, they FULFILLED the
timeloop's causal connections. Their earlier selves, in the 40th
Century, didn't know that their LATER selves 'pre-existed' in the
20th Century... until they time-traveled back to 1973, which they
were PREDESTINED TO DO. Their little jaunt back in Time crossed the
T's and dotted the I's and served its function of fulfilling
causality. They HAD to do it, without realizing that they had to,
because otherwise there would be a PARADOX involved, and Nature
abhors paradoxes as much as it abhors a vacuum. Come to think of it,
as much as our last dog abhorred the vacuum cleaner...

Patrick

Yeah – it’s a DIFFERENT plague….like many other things the various components of the ape takeover are sped up because Zira and Cornelius visit their past.  Otherwise the plague was going to happen hundreds of years later as it did in the initial timeline….

10, 9, 8, 7, 6………

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:14 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...and MORE new WITHIN!?!??!

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, mlccougar@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 12/8/2005 5:19:38 PM Central Standard Time,
abmac@i...
> writes:
>
> > Cornelius and Zira erased their history when they went back.
> >
> EXACTLY!!!!!!

*** Exactly WRONG. The 'history' that Cornelius and Zira tell Hasslein
about includes a Plague that kills all the dogs and cats -- which
happens, 10 years later, in 1983

Who you callin a changed timeliner, circle boy?!?!?! ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:14 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...and MORE new WITHIN!?!??!

The ONLY 'proof' you changed-timeliners can regurgitate is the "2
centuries" and "3 more centuries" lines of Cornelius and Zira, claiming
that "Aldo" was a 25th Century ape who first spoke "No!" to a human.

Look outside the window at the bar Patrick!

We have jumped a few years my friend and there are soldiers marching….a certain General is threatening protestors……

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:21 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Patrick - take a breath, and go check out the hairy bartender.  :-)

*** Okay, Mike. "Out with ze bad air... in with ze good!" (a banana
to the monkey who knows what movie that line's from).

Okay... the hairy bartender. Yes, amusing... and Ape acting like a
Man!

I'm more concerned with the dialogue between Milo and Cornelius. How
can Milo have been informing Cornelius about "flying machines" at
this point, when LATER (during the Q&A scene in "PLANET") Cornelius
tells Taylor that "Flight is a scientific impossibility!"

So yeah – while WITHIN is set 7-10 years prior, it is also set at the end of BENEATH!

With a few other things chucked in!  J

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:21 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Patrick - take a breath, and go check out the hairy bartender.  :-)

*** Okay, Mike. "Out with ze bad air... in with ze good!" (a banana
to the monkey who knows what movie that line's from).

Okay... the hairy bartender. Yes, amusing... and Ape acting like a
Man!

I'm more concerned with the dialogue between Milo and Cornelius. How
can Milo have been informing Cornelius about "flying machines" at
this point, when LATER (during the Q&A scene in "PLANET") Cornelius
tells Taylor that "Flight is a scientific impossibility!"

Wouldn't Cornelius have been the LAST ape -- other than Milo -- to
insist that Taylor's idea is far-fetched, that he'd arrived on their
world via a "flying machine"?

Later in "PLANET", during the Tribunal, Cornelius tells the
orangutans that he doesn't accept the notion that Taylor "fell"
or "flew" out of the sky... but he DOES claim that Taylor came from
somewhere in the Forbidden Zone, because he himself had been there
and knows that Taylor described it to him accurately. And Zira, also
disbelieving Taylor's claim to having FLOWN to their world from
another planet in another solar system, reasons that Taylor must
have "sprang from our own... Yes, Sprang!"

It seems to me that these details from "PLANET" don't jibe with this
page from "WITHIN".

You got s'more 'splainin' to do, Mike!!!

Patrick

Yes Patrick but he did not have EVIDENCE that they had been speaking English for 1000s of years!  It was more likely an answer based on teachings of his faith, rather than based on his scientific evidence.

What you are saying is, if they has gone back 10 minutes instead of 2000 years, they could make love to themselves!  That’s just WRONG Patrick and you are WICKED to even allow such a thing!  SHAME ON YOU!!!  J

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:14 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...and MORE new WITHIN!?!??!

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, mlccougar@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 12/8/2005 5:19:38 PM Central Standard Time,
abmac@i...
> writes:
>
> > Cornelius and Zira erased their history when they went back.
> >
> EXACTLY!!!!!!

*** Exactly WRONG. The 'history' that Cornelius and Zira tell Hasslein
about includes a Plague that kills all the dogs and cats -- which
happens, 10 years later, in 1983. The domestication of Apes as pets to
replace those lost dogs and cats -- which happens. The later
enslavement of those pet Apes -- which happens. And the eventual
overthrow of Man by those Apes after they revolt, after having first
met in "small groups" -- just like the Watch Commander mentions,
regarding the "unauthorized ape gathering at the foot of Ramp Six", etc.

The ONLY 'proof' you changed-timeliners can regurgitate is the "2
centuries" and "3 more centuries" lines of Cornelius and Zira, claiming
that "Aldo" was a 25th Century ape who first spoke "No!" to a human.

But Cornelius earlier said that his people's ancestors had been
speaking English for "nearly 2,000 years" -- NOT only for the last
1,500 years. This later contradictory timeline of Ape English-speaking
is a purposeful LIE. To protect Caesar from Hasslein. And, by
naming "Aldo" as the uppity ape, Cornelius hopes to protect Caesar's
son from the killer gorilla whom he'd read about in "the Secret
Scrolls" that Zaius had kept hidden from the masses.

They didn't ERASE their history -- they FULFILLED it!

Patrick

That WAS a fucking twist too Patrick….you L H BASTARD!!!  J

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:27 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...

Look outside the window at the bar Patrick!

We have jumped a few years my friend and there are soldiers marching….a certain General is threatening protestors……

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2005 3:21 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Timelines...

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@c...> wrote:
>
> Patrick - take a breath, and go check out the hairy bartender.  :-)

*** Okay, Mike. "Out with ze bad air... in with ze good!" (a banana
to the monkey who knows what movie that line's from).

Okay... the hairy bartender. Yes, amusing... and Ape acting like a
Man!

I'm more concerned with the dialogue between Milo and Cornelius. How
can Milo have been informing Cornelius about "flying machines" at
this point, when LATER (during the Q&A scene in "PLANET") Cornelius
tells Taylor that "Flight is a scientific impossibility!"