-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony B. McElveen
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 8:36 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

Speaking of interpreting, I'm sorry I couldn't find anyone to interpret the Hungarian text. Although many people of Hungarian descent live in this town and proudly celebrate their heritage, the language has apparently been forgotten.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gp3085
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 10:51 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

I think what Patrick's pointed out is interesting, and it may be
worthwhile, as a separate project, to see if any other translations of
the original French text made the same error.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TZer0@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 7:05 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Thanks Neil..... [SEC=PERSONAL]

 

A big THANKS to Neil for doing this.

I think it's really cool!  And no, I don't think

$100 per page is excessive for storyboards.

That is in Australian dollars, isn't it?

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gp3085
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 10:51 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

I think what Patrick's pointed out is interesting, and it may be
worthwhile, as a separate project, to see if any other translations of
the original French text made the same error. But I also agree with
Neil that it's not worth changing the text he's adapting for the
comic. Aside from his point about where you draw the line in fixing
any mistranslations, the current English translation is the one we're
all used to, and fans who read the comic are more likely to see the
comic as 'wrong' if it doesn't match that text.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 4:29 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] MONKEY PLANET page 000

This whole comic looks like it will be quite interesting. ..

Now I've always loved the APES film much more than the source novel it was adapted from, but I've always been curious to see Monkey Planet as a comic (since the chances of it being filmed are quite slim to say the least...)

 

> This whole comic looks like it will be quite
> interesting...
>
> Now I've always loved the APES film much more than
> the source novel it was
> adapted from, but I've always been curious to see
> Monkey Planet as a comic
> (since the chances of it being filmed are quite slim
> to say the least...)
>

> -- Hey Anthony it's not a problem, thanks for
> actually offering to try
> to help in the first place. I did try to use one of
> those online
> translation sites but the results I came up with
> were just downright
> scary!
> That is why I eventually decided to just use the
> text from Boulle's
> novel. The end result may not be exactly what the
> words said in the
> original comic but at least it does tell the story.
>
> Neil
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Anthony B. McElveen
> Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 8:36 AM
> To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000
>
>
>
> Speaking of interpreting, I'm sorry I couldn't find
> anyone to interpret
> the Hungarian text. Although many people of
> Hungarian descent live in
> this town and proudly celebrate their heritage, the
> language has
> apparently been forgotten.
>
> .
>
>

>

>
>
>
>

----- Original Message -----
From: mlccougar@...
Date: Monday, November 6, 2006 1:29 am
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

> In a message dated 11/5/2006 4:18:10 PM Central Standard Time,
> ntfoster@... writes:
>
>
> >
>
> It is not...
>

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gp3085
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 10:42 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: New Comix.

I can only imagine how much work is involved, both in
cleaning up the pages and adapting the novel's text to fit the
illustrations.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 7:17 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [PotaDG] MONKEY PLANET page 000

I’m always fascinated to see how artists interpret Boulle’s Monkey Planet apes because, having seen the movie first, I can’t budge the image of John Chambers’ apes when I think of the “talking monkeys”!

 

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Whitty, Michael" <whitty@...> wrote:
>
> I think what's missing here is a big thanks to Neil who is
typically doing a
> lot of hard work for no obvious reward.
>
> As usual, I invited people to share the financial burden and nobody
> volunteered. So I paid out (and, would you believe, the guy said
he never
> received the payment so I paid TWICE!!!).
>
> Neil has put in weeks on end of scanning and cleaning up the images
(they
> were in great need). We were expecting some translations, but
decided to
> push on and Neil has interpreted what he can, and inserted the text
(which I
> think goes in perfectly well and flows nicely).
>
> I think it's a case of people taking for granted all the work that
goes in.
> So hey how about some nice positive, thankful contributions then
later we
> can get picky ok? :-)
>
> Michael
>
>
>
>
>
>

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 4:30 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

In a message dated 11/5/2006 4:18:10 PM Central Standard Time, ntfoster@bigpond. com writes:

I'm now thinking it will be another waste of time sharing this comic.

It is not...

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 4:31 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

In a message dated 11/5/2006 4:37:08 PM Central Standard Time, abmac@... writes:

I think the comic looks great, and it has a very '60s feel to it.

That brings up a good question: What is the copyright or date of publication on the comic? Is it from the 70s?

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 4:31 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

In a message dated 11/5/2006 4:37:08 PM Central Standard Time, abmac@... writes:

I think the comic looks great, and it has a very '60s feel to it.

That brings up a good question: What is the copyright or date of publication on the comic? Is it from the 70s?

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of PofTAfan@...
Sent: Monday, 6 November 2006 3:17 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

I got this Animation
master program and I am going to attempt to do a Planet of the Apes
animation short.

.

__._,___

Hi Neil,

Just too echo what Dario said. All the work every one puts in to things which they share with the  group is always appreciated by myself and I'm sure most of the  people here. Sometimes life gets in the way so people can't respond straight away ( I mean I go away for a day and have you seen how many posts are on the site ) but It is appreciated big time!!

Best Graham.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
>
> Forget the naysayers Neil. It's great as it is. Thanks!
>
> Dario
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: mlccougar@...
> Date: Monday, November 6, 2006 1:29 am
> Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000
>
> > In a message dated 11/5/2006 4:18:10 PM Central Standard Time,
> > ntfoster@... writes:
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > It is not...
> >
>

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@...> wrote:
>
> I'm always fascinated to see how artists interpret Boulle's Monkey
> Planet apes because, having seen the movie first, I can't budge the
> image of John Chambers' apes when I think of the "talking monkeys"!
>
 As a kid, when I read the book I always pictured it like some of the later pr-prodution drawings from the film, which I'd seen in the UK weekly. ( I wasn't really aware of the earlier ones closer to the book with a "modern" setting)

There was one in-particular that stayed with me of the ape surgery with two very "ape" like figures (It's in #12 of the weekly). It was very grey,all charcoal and pencil,  atmospheric.

This stuck, so when I read the book  for some reason I always "saw" it like this, black and white almost film noir, which I suppose is quite appropriate considering it was French  

Best graham.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Graham Hill
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 7:40 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

Just too echo what Dario said. All the work every one puts in to things which they share with the  group is always appreciated by myself and I'm sure most of the  people here.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TZer0@...
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 5:26 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] MONKEY PLANET page 000

In a message dated 11/6/2006 5:28:34 A.M. Central Standard Time, ntfoster@bigpond. com writes:

-- And I must say that personally I think the artwork is absolutely outstanding. This is exactly how I would have wanted to see Monkey Planet illustrated.

 

Neil

 

Wait! 

Didn't you draw these?

 

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, mlccougar@... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 11/6/2006 6:28:29 PM Central Standard Time,
> PotaDG@yahoogroups.com writes:
>
>
> > You can access this file at the URL:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/001.jpg
>
> *** Again, this is very interesting, and thanks to all involved...
>

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 6:12 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: {Disarmed} Re: [PotaDG] Re: New file uploaded to PotaDG

Probably because they are light and small, but you are right - they could belong to a child.

.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Graham Hill
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 8:31 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

As a kid, when I read the book I always pictured it like some of the later pr-prodution drawings from the film, which I'd seen in the UK weekly. ( I wasn't really aware of the earlier ones closer to the book with a "modern" setting)

There was one in-particular that stayed with me of the ape surgery with two very "ape" like figures (It's in #12 of the weekly). It was very grey,all charcoal and pencil,  atmospheric.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Graham Hill
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 8:31 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

 As a kid, when I read the book I always pictured it like some of the later pr-prodution drawings from the film, which I'd seen in the UK weekly. ( I wasn't really aware of the earlier ones closer to the book with a "modern" setting)

.

--------- Original Message --------
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
To: "PotaDG@yahoogroups.com" <PotaDG@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: {Disarmed} RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000
Date: 08/11/06 19:07

-- Speaking of the look of the apes etc. I do think that Mr. Zorad Erno did a fantastic job on the comic. His art is beautiful and it must have been a hell of a job adapting the novel to the comic format.

 

Neil

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups. com [PotaDG@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Graham Hill
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 8:31 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

 As a kid, when I read the book I always pictured it like some of the later pr-prodution drawings from the film, which I'd seen in the UK weekly. ( I wasn't really aware of the earlier ones closer to the book with a "modern" setting)

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony B. McElveen
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 1:16 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] New file uploaded to PotaDG

I love the inkwork. It reminds me a lot of the Warren horror magazines, Creepy and Eerie.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 2:25 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: New file uploaded to PotaDG

*** And speaking of those footprints, as mentioned before, it really is kinda funny that right off the bat they assume they are a woman's footprints.. .

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TZer0@...
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 4:54 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: New file uploaded to PotaDG

Footprints?  What footprints.

I must ha missed something.

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Whitty
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 7:23 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: {Disarmed} RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

However I'm sure you are pleased not to be doing a MP comic!  :)

 

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <ntfoster@...> wrote:
>
> -- Yes, quite happy about that! Though I must say I did have fun
doing
> those chapter illustrations a while back. We'll have to get back to
that
> one of these days.
>
> Neil

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <ntfoster@...> wrote:
>
> -- Yeah, great artwork, I love it.
>
> I have just uploaded the next page to the Group's Files section.
>
> Neil

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 3:09 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: {Disarmed} RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

Actually I don’t think we did ever show all of those....

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 6:36 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] MONKEY PLANET

Yes the Monkey Planet comic WAS on the list, but I am pleased enough with this one not to make that a priority.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mlccougar@...
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 1:09 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: adapting MONKEY PLANET

*** The part about lots of text missing is no surprise, I mean you only have so much room in those boxes... I guess my question is: When you added the text to the comic, did you do a straight adaption of what they originally had, or did you just look at the box and the scene depicted and just add text from the novel itself?

One off the cuff comment: Where's their little chimp Hector?

.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil" <ntfoster@...> wrote:

Neil said: -- Yes it is the Hungarian comic and no I won't be
changing it. Does it really make that much difference? So it may be
wrong, but as it is the English version we have had unchanged since
the early sixties I see no point in revising it. If we started doing
that then we may as well trash the whole thing as there are probably
numerous incorrect translations throughout the English version of the
book.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Neil also said: -- I myself really don't care about such little mis-
interpretations of what was originally written in the French version
of a book about talking apes. I must say I am a bit miffed (but not
surprised) with the instant negativity. I suppose it is par for the
course on here though. I'm now thinking it will be another waste of
time sharing this comic.
----------------------------------------------------------------
"its the who???" said: Physician,Physicist ?? Does it really
matter??? NO it does not you're just being bloody picky and just a
bit anal about it.

Seriously who would read something like this and then go and check
the translation of 'physicien' or even if they knew what it was why
bother mentioning it,do you have a lot of spare time !?

Thanks to Neil for putting all this hardwork in and for Michael
getting it in ther first place.I for one can live with this terrible
mis-translation !!!
Got to say that Ulysse look's nothing like i imagined him when i've
read the book...but hey it all still looks great !!

Me

-------------------------------------------------------------------

And Mike said: Thanks Patrick. Are there any other prominent mis-
translations?
===============================================================

And now here's my reply.

Jeez Louise! I wasn't ragging on Neil for making a mistake! I wasn't
saying he's an asshole for NOT knowing that Xan Fielding made a
mistake in translation that he -- unwittingly -- introduced to this
English-version of a Hungarian comic-version of Boulle's book. I
wasn't implying in ANY way that Neil's efforts to present this
fascinating POTA comic are unappreciated by me -- or SHOULD be
unappreciated by others due to a single faux pas.

Neil asks "Does it really make that much difference?" and whoever the
hell "it's the who???"/"Me" is asks "Physician,Physicist?? Does it
really matter???"

And my answer to that is YES, IT MATTERS! Just because Xan Fielding
managed to get his translation vetted and published way back when
without an editor fluent in French noticing and CORRECTING his
English version of Boulle's text, THAT DOESN'T MAKE HIS TRANSLATION
AN ACCURATE RENDERING OF BOULLE'S ORIGINAL WORK. And I should think
that we, here, in POTA-land, would and should care about the
integrity of the ORIGINAL author and creator's work to prefer to see
it as he intended.

Did Boulle know or realize that Xan Fielding had screwed up his
translation in regards to the French word "physicien"? Probably not;
if Boulle HAD caught it, he would've had the power -- in all
probability -- to insist on a corrective change in the translation.

I asked, before, if any other foreign translation of Boulle's French
text had made the same mistake regarding this word, not having access
to any Italian or German or Russian (etc) translation myself. For all
I know, it is ONLY in the Xan Fielding English translation where this
mistake occurred. This is due to what is known (in translation
circles) as a "false friend": a word from an original language which
LOOKS like a word in a foreign language and might then be
mistranslated as such. The French word "physicien" LOOKS like the
English word "physician" -- making "physician" a 'false friend'
of "physicien" -- and THAT is why Xan Fielding fell into the trap. He
ASSUMED that the two words -- looking so alike -- had the same
meaning, that he mistranslated the text.

And ever since, English readers of Boulle's novel -- not knowing the
original text -- have been under the false impression that Arthur
Levain was a DOCTOR -- as in a MEDICAL PRACTITIONER, a SURGEON, a
MEDIC, what have you. Not only that, but a "PHYSICIAN" with a great
future, supposedly.

But that is NOT what Boulle was saying in his novel! He said (in
French) that Arthur Levain was a PHYSICIST -- a guy more along the
lines of a NEWTON or an EINSTEIN or a HASSLEIN. Professor Antelle,
among other things, was the guy who FINANCED the Betelgeuse voyage:
as it says in the book:

"It was the learned Professor Antelle who made this decision. The
principal ORGANIZER of the enterprise, to which he devoted the whole
of his ENORMOUS FORTUNE, the leader of our expedition, he himself had
conceived the spaceship and directed its construction."

We also learn that Antelle was knowledgable in other fields:

"This sort of conversation occupied our leisure hours on board and at
the same time made me appreciate Professor Antelle's prodigious skill
all the more. There was no field he had not explored, and I was
pleased to have a leader like him on such a hazardous enterprise."

So, Antelle is a polymath -- a genius who had studied ALL fields of
human knowledge and whose genius led to the acquiring of an enormous
fortune which enabled him to finance the construction of a starship
able to accelerate to Einsteinian relativistic velocities -- so that
he could make his one-and-only voyage to another star, his favorite
star Betelgeuse in his own lifetime.

However, he had grown "tired of his fellow men"... he had become the
misanthrope that Taylor -- in the movie -- would be portrayed as.

So why bring along ANY other people?

He brings along Ulysse Merou after discovering TWO things about him:
he had no family AND he played chess reasonably well! But it was
probably for a THIRD reason that Ulysse was taken along: he was a
JOURNALIST. After the voyage -- if it were to be a success -- Antelle
wants the STORY of that first interstellar voyage to be told. He,
like Landon in the movie, wants the "immortality" and the "glory" of
being the first (hence "best") to accomplish the feat of traveling to
another star. Antelle may be a misanthrope, not LIKING the human race
all that much any more, but that does NOT mean he doesn't want
posterity to know who it was who accomplished that first star voyage.
Professor Antelle, thus, is not only a Genius, a Polymath, a Tycoon,
an Inventor, and a Misanthrope -- he's also VAIN.

He is all these things because BOULLE depicted him as such.

So, we know why he took Ulysse Merou along: as a Journalist, Merou
would be the one to record Antelle's triumphs. As he says, "This was
an outstanding opportunity for a young journalist. Even if my story
was not to be published for 800 years, perhaps for that very reason
it would have unusual value." Antelle -- presuming the voyage went
well -- would die knowing that posterity would be told by Merou of
his marvelous achievement.

But why bring that OTHER guy along -- Arthur Levain?

The all-too-brief bit in the book tells us that Levain was
Antelle's "disciple... a young PHYSICIST with a great future".
Antelle conceived, financed, and had built the world's first
interstellar spacecraft. Reading behind-the-lines, I suspect that
Antelle would succeed where others had failed because the mainstream
scientists of the late 25th Century probably considered the
construction of such a starship an impossibility. Only Arthur Levain,
of all the physicists of their time, considered Antelle's project
worthwhile -- so he BECAME the professor's disciple. It probably
stroked Antelle's ego to know that at least ONE other physicist took
seriously this attempt to build a starship capable of near-light
velocities. It was Antelle's VANITY that led to him taking along his
like-minded "disciple". And what about that "great future"? Well,
since the voyage should prove to be a success, then the fact that
Arthur Levain ALONE saw the genius in Antelle's project and had "bet
on that long shot" (so to speak), Levain -- when he returned to Earth
some 800 years later -- would be ACKNOWLEDGED by fellow Earth
physicists as having been on the right side against Orthodoxy.

Antelle saw his contemporaries as fools. "He would often declare that
he did not expect much from them any more, and this probably explains
why he ... limited the number of the passengers to three," Merou
relates.

He brought Levain along because Levain ALONE agreed with his
unorthodox conception of a near-lightspeed starship, and he brought
along Merou so that the brilliance of Antelle could be recorded for
posterity upon the return to Earth. The concept of VANITY is at play
here: perhaps Boulle was hinting at that when he named the
disciple "Arthur Levain": in French "le vain" means "the vain". The
word "levain" means "leaven" as in Leavened Bread: in the Old
Testament the Israelites were forbidden from eating puffed-up bread,
since the presence of leaven makes bread expand, puff up, just like
PRIDE makes a vain man's heart puff-up with self-importance. During
the Feast of Unleavened Bread, Jews have to meticulously remove every
iota of leaven from their homes -- symbolically, they have to remove
all trace of Pride from their hearts -- just as their ancestors did
prior to the Exodus, when God sent the Angel of Death to kill the
Firstborn children throughout Egypt during the first Feast of
Unleavened Bread, that original "passover" meal. Thus, whether we are
to read Arthur's last name as "Le Vain" or as "Levain", the name
refers symbolically to Vanity and Pride -- either his own, Antelle's,
or BOTH of their's.

Due to Xan Fielding's mistranslation, though, English readers and
POTA fans in particular have been under the false impression that
Antelle probably brought the guy along because he needed a medic with
him, just in case there was a medical emergency during the 2-year
(shiptime) voyage. I know that when I first read the novel, that's
the impression I got from the "physician" reference.

It wasn't until I ordered a copy of the original French-language text
from "PRESSES POCKET"/"JULLIARD", and began transcribing the text
into Microsoft Word format, and then -- on a whim -- looked up the
word "physicien" in "CASSELL'S FRENCH-ENGLISH DICTIONARY", that I
noticed the true meaning of that word.

It was an easy mistake for Fielding to make. 'Physicien' is a "false
friend"... it LOOKS like the English word "physician"... so he
screwed up and mistranslated it as such. And, in doing so, he
distorted our understanding of what Boulle was trying to describe.
What a difference ONE SINGLE WORD can make!

Think of ANOTHER word that is a "false friend" of sorts: the French
word "singe". It means "ape" in English, deriving probably from the
Latin word "simius" from which we get the English word "simian". But
it LOOKS like the English word "singe" -- as in TO BURN. Imagine if
some mediocre translator were to translate the title of the
novel, "La Planete des Singes" as "The Planet of the Burned Ones"...
all due to his mistaking the French word "singe" for the English
word "singe" -- assuming these "false friends" to have the same
meaning! Stupid, right? If Xan Fielding is still alive, and if he
could be shown his "physicien"/"physician" mistake, I'm sure he'd be
the first to smack his forehead with his palm and exclaim, "D'OH!"
like Homer Simpson.

Does any of this really matter? you ask. Does it make any difference?

If you care about the integrity of your OWN words -- if, for example,
you were to publish a novel only to learn that a foreign-language
edition had MISTRANSLATED your words and given foreign readers false
information, distorted (innocently) what you had been trying to
express -- then YES it DOES matter, doesn't it? The Italian poet
Dante went so far as to say that a Translator is a Traitor of sorts --
he puns on the two words in Italian, which look almost the
same: "traduttore" means Translator and "traditore" means Traitor,
showing how just 1 or 2 letters can alter the meaning of like-
sounding words. Dante knew that his own works would be translated
into French, German, English (etc), and every translator of Dante's
works KNOWS his opinion about translation being tantamount to
treason. Dante was giving posterity a slap-on-the-wrist to warn them
against MISTRANSLATING his words. And I've read enough translations
of Dante's COMMEDIA to have seen his text mistranslated time and time
again, so I know he was justified in his antipathy regarding
translation.

If you care about the integrity of your own words... of Boulle's
text... of ANY foreign-language text you know ONLY through
translation... then IT MATTERS. It SHOULD matter, I think.

If it sounds like I'm ragging on Xan Fielding, well, I'm not, really.
Everybody makes mistakes, and I caught him on one. An unintentional
goof on his part -- but one which has led to misunderstandings of
Boulle's novel. I don't think it was a minor misunderstanding,
either, though others are free to think it minor. I don't think we
can fully understand the character of Antelle without knowing that
Levain was his PHYSICIST disciple -- the lone vindicator of his own
genius. Imagine being the ONLY one who knows a Truth... being a voice
crying in the wilderness that nobody takes seriously... and then
finally learning that ONE PERSON shares your belief, takes you
seriously, and is willing to be your "disciple". THAT is what Arthur
Levain was to Professor Antelle. A vindicator. A lone sympathizer, at
least amongst the professional Physicists on Earth. The pooh-poohing
of ALL THE OTHERS has led to Antelle becoming a misanthrope. Unless
we understand this aspect to the story, we can't fully appreciate
what Boulle was trying to convey, I think.

I'm sorry if Neil thinks that I was being "instantly negative" -- I
don't consider my comment to be Negative, as in a criticism of his
efforts. I APPLAUD Neil's efforts. I was concerned that BOULLE'S text
was unintentionally and innocently being misconstrued yet again, all
due to Xan Fielding's mistake. I would prefer that we be true to
Boulle rather than 'true' to a translator's text. But if Neil doesn't
care to change the two little letters -- from physiciAN to physiciST -
- so as to make this comic truer to Boulle... then that's his
prerogative. I don't think it's "negative" of me to address the fact
that this misstates what Boulle had written, that this mistake takes
away from the true meaning of the text. I applaud Neil's efforts in
presenting this artwork with text that we English-speakers can
understand (I, for one, am not fluent in Hungarian in ANY way!). The
actual artwork is not -- AND CANNOT BE -- "mistranslated". But the
WORDS accompanying the arwork CAN.

Am I the only one here who cares about the integrity of Boulle's
text? I'd hate to think so.

Patrick

P.S. I won't go into it here, but the etymology of the Hebrew word-
name "Cain"/"Qayin" has been misunderstood for THOUSANDS of years...
and if you only knew how the meaning of that name relates to the
story about his conception, you'd shit a brick!

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Tuesday, 7 November 2006 8:34 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

Amen brother T

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Whitty
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 6:19 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: {Disarmed} RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

Dude – that’s not his name is it?  ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups. com [PotaDG@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Neil T Foster
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 7:44 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups. com
Subject: {Disarmed} RE: [PotaDG] Re: MONKEY PLANET page 000

-- Speaking of the look of the apes etc. I do think that Mr. Zorad Erno did a fantastic job on the comic. His art is beautiful and it must have been a hell of a job adapting the novel to the comic format.

.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, PotaDG@yahoogroups.com wrote:
>
>
> Hello,
>
> This email message is a notification to let you know that
> a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
> group.
>
> File : /002.jpg
> Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <ntfoster@...>
> Description :
>
> You can access this file at the URL:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/002.jpg
>
> To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
> http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files
>
> Regards,
>
> munkeyman63au <ntfoster@...>
>

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Greg Plonowski <urko3085@...> wrote:
>
> Marvel UK issue 108 is now available to download from Hunter's
site. In this issue the adaptation of Battle for the Planet of the
Apes begins. There's also a letter column and another installment of
the reprinting of the Planet adaptation.
>
> Also this week the first two issues of Simian Scrolls are
available to download in PDF format. Thanks to John Roche, Dave
Ballard and all the contributors to Simian Scrolls. More back issues
will be made available in the weeks ahead.
>
> https://pota.goatley.com
>
> Thanks,
> Greg
>

> -- I used a number of techniques, which included working parts out

> an online translator, figuring out which passages of text fitted

> the pictures and some of those translations and even sometimes by
> picking out certain key words and names and matching them up to the

> from the novel.
>
> Where's Hector? Completely left out of the story, along with a few

> key parts I'm afraid. That though is the way the comic was adapted.
>
> Neil
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On

> Of mlccougar@...
> Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 1:09 PM
> To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [PotaDG] Re: adapting MONKEY PLANET
>
>
> *** The part about lots of text missing is no surprise, I mean you

> have so much room in those boxes... I guess my question is: When you
> added the text to the comic, did you do a straight adaption of what

> originally had, or did you just look at the box and the scene

> and just add text from the novel itself?
>
> One off the cuff comment: Where's their little chimp Hector?
> .
>
> <http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?

> sgId=41925/stime=1162955674/nc1=3858797/nc2=3848611/nc3=3848443>
>

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 2:51 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Birthday Reminder

Reminder from:		PotaDG's Calendar
Title:		Jeff Krueger's Birthday!
Date:		Wednesday November 8, 2006
Time:		All Day
Repeats:		This event repeats every year.
Description:		Congratulations, Jeff! Have a great day!
Yahoo! Greetings:		Send a Yahoo! Greeting
Yahoo! Shopping:		Browse Yahoo! Shopping Gift Guide

Copyright © 2006  Yahoo! Inc.  All Rights Reserved | | Privacy Policy

>
> > As I said I haven't read the novel and maybe this is the closest

> > so thanks a lot for all the work you've put into it.
> >
> ***You can pick up Monkey Planet very cheaply on eBay, etc. You

> it out if you are able to...***
>

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Greg Plonowski
Sent: Wednesday, 8 November 2006 10:42 AM
To: pota@yahoogroups.com; potadg@yahoogroups.com; friends & fugitives
Subject: [PotaDG] Marvel UK 108 and Simian Scrolls

Marvel UK issue 108 is now available to download from Hunter's site. In this issue the adaptation of Battle for the Planet of the Apes begins. There's also a letter column and another installment of the reprinting of the Planet adaptation.

 

Also this week the first two issues of Simian Scrolls are available to download in PDF format. Thanks to John Roche, Dave Ballard and all the contributors to Simian Scrolls. More back issues will be made available in the weeks ahead.

 

https://pota. goatley.com

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of nlmoxham
Sent: Thursday, 9 November 2006 12:41 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: adapting MONKEY PLANET

The audio version I mentioned last week makes no mention of Phylis
and Jinn.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of nlmoxham
Sent: Thursday, 9 November 2006 12:41 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: adapting MONKEY PLANET

I was wondering though, if parts were simply left
out or if short cuts were taken that contradicted the original story
(mis-translations aside)? And also how long is the comic, to get an
idea of how thorough it is?

.

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TZer0@...
Sent: Friday, 10 November 2006 3:43 PM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Re: adapting MONKEY PLANET

In a message dated 11/9/2006 9:00:05 P.M. Central Standard Time, mlccougar@aol. com writes:

So Neil DIDN'T draw it?

.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <ntfoster@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Neil
>

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <ntfoster@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Neil
>

>
>
> Hello,
>
> This email message is a notification to let you know that
> a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
> group.
>
> File : /Comics/POTA Begins/06 pencils.jpg
> Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <ntfoster@...>
> Description :
>
> You can access this file at the URL:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/POTA%20Begins/06%

>
> To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
> http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files
>
> Regards,
>
> munkeyman63au <ntfoster@...>

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <ntfoster@...> wrote:

Here are a few different translations of the following passage from
Boulle's book: 'himself; his disciple Arthur Levain, a young
physician with a great future;'

German:
er selbst; sein schüler Arthur Levain, ein junger Physiker mit großer
zukunft

Dutch:
hijzelf, Arthur Levain, zijn leerling, een jong, veelbelovend fysicus,
en ik

Italian:
lui stesso, il suo discepolo Arthur Levain, giovane fisico di grande
avvenire

Unlike the English translation they clearly translate as physicist or
something close to it. Looks like the English language version alone
got it wrong.

Neil

---------------------------------------------------------------

*** Thanks for the samples, Neil. Say, where'd you get your German,
Dutch, and Italian translations? Ebay? Amazon.com? Off the web at
all, or through some other source? If there's a website where these
items might be available, clue me in so I can order up some other
editions. I have about a dozen of the Xan Fielding translation
editions in my collection, and two of the original French-language
ones (with different covers), but I don't have any 'foreign' versions
other than the English-language one.

And, let me state again that I think it's great that this Hungarian
comic is being made available for us in a language accessible to us.
I suspect that you are not only supplying the English text but also
cleaning up the artwork: the stuff is in Black-&-White and the white
is so BRIGHT a white that it can't be merely a scanned-in image. This
comic was printed in the 1970s, right? Chances are the paper it was
printed on has yellowed a tad by now, I'm guessing. This online
version looks pristine, though. How do you do it? Are you using
Photoshop or something similar, and is there a 'tool' that can
brighten up faded yellowing scanned images?

Patrick

-----Original Message-----
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of patrickmichaeltilton
Sent: Monday, 13 November 2006 12:40 AM
To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: For Neil

*** Thanks for the samples, Neil. Say, where'd you get your German,
Dutch, and Italian translations? Ebay? Amazon.com? Off the web at
all, or through some other source?