.html
-- <.html

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , "patrickmichaeltilton"
<patrickmichaeltilton@...> wrote:

> Neil, I can see that the names of the astronauts on the left

are "VIRDON" and "BURKE", but I can't quite make out the names of the
two characters on the right. If you have the original, can you
read 'em or perhaps scan 'em in at a higher resolution?

-- Sorry Patrick but that is the only copy I have.

Neil

.html.html In a message dated 3/21/06 8:21:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, veetus@... writes:

It's been announced that the old show "Lancelot Link: Secret Chimp" will be available on DVD June 13th. It's the complete series on a 2 disc set. It was a spy spoof using real chimps dressed in costumes and was on around the time of POTA's prime. Probably not very PC today but I know some Ape fans have been waiting.

  http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/newsitem.cfm?NewsID=5353   - - - Jeff


I remember an article in LIFE magazine when the show originally came out that said that the chimp playing Lance Link was used as a model for the makeup men on PLANET OF THE APES.  So there's your direct POTA connection to that show!

I think I still have the article buried someplace.

-- Rory<.html <.html

.html.html In a message dated 3/21/06 8:29:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, whitty@... writes:

Thanks Jeff.

Don't tell Rory!   SHHHhhhhhh hhhhh.........



Michael



Too late!  I'll be buying this.  At least you don't have to pay a hundred bucks for a Lance Link head!

-- Rory Link<.html <.html

I'll be getting that...I have a few episodes on a fan
transfer DVD but the quality sucks......it's Extremely
dated but that's whats fun about it...

and The Evolution Revolution!!

Tim

--- Michael Whitty <whitty@...> wrote:

> Thanks Jeff.
>
> Don't tell Rory! SHHHhhhhhhhhhhh.........
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
> Of veetus@...
> Sent: Wednesday, 22 March 2006 12:25 AM
> To: the gang; PotaDG@yahoogroups.com;
> pota_Phenomenon@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [PotaDG] OT: Ape ultimate collection
> (Lancelot Link)
>
> It's been announced that the old show "Lancelot
> Link: Secret Chimp"
> will be available on DVD June 13th. It's the
> complete series on a 2 disc
> set. It was a spy spoof using real chimps dressed in
> costumes and was on
> around the time of POTA's prime. Probably not very
> PC today but I know
> some Ape fans have been waiting.
>
> http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/newsitem.cfm?NewsID=5353
> - - - Jeff
>
> --
>

.html.html In a message dated 3/20/2006 2:16:11 AM Central Standard Time, whitty@... writes:

 

Maybe he should explore a "pay to view" internet site.




What good would that do? Wouldn't you rather have this stuff compiled into a book that you can look at anywhere, at your leisure (rather than having to be glued in front of a monitor?)<.html <.html

.html <.html

.html <.html

Attachments :

.html <.html

Just to be clear (before someone goes on ebay and buys a whole lot),
Jack Kirby only worked on the initial Kamandi comics and it was later
passed on to other writers/artists. He did about half of them.

Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: Neil <nfoster@...>
Date: Monday, March 20, 2006 2:35 am
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Kirby POTA cartoon concept sketch

> --- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Haristas@... wrote:
> > Anyway, is Jack Kirby dead
>
> -- Yes he is (but his work will live on forever!)
>
> > and what was this POTA-like comic he did?
>
> -- Kamandi, The Last Boy On Earth. DC comics, 59 issues from 1972
> to '78.
>
> Neil
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Isn't that ironic? A proposed storyline dealing with a 'Lazarus' and
then the story dies, the one thing that cannot happen to the character?

Not sure what is happening with this. I thought it was going to be a
group collaborative project. I put in my two cents which was just the
suggestion that a character named Lazarus be used, with the intent to
develop the associated connotations to that name, but never heard
anyone else mention anything. Are people working on this in the
background now?

If not, how about some suggestions? Maybe even just another character
proposal to get the juices flowing.

Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: LordTZer0@...
Date: Monday, March 20, 2006 4:34 am
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Other new comics

>
> In a message dated 3/6/2006 5:32:29 P.M. Central Standard Time,
> whitty@... writes:
>
> I'd like to combine T's Zira story with a story about Zaius and
> LAZARUS
>
>
> Lazarus . . . Lazarus! Arise!
> Is the Lazarus storyline dead, or what?
>
>
>

I don't know about that. As it happens, I was not very active in POTA
fandom when the Russo book came out. Sure I was a fan and had a few
POTA collectibles and all that, but I was not active to the point of
even checking out if there were POTA discussion groups or POTA sites.

But even then, when I saw "Revisited" at the local bookstore, I
immediately bought it (and it was NOT cheap!).

Obviously, I've upped my interest and expanded my activities since
then. (Hey, I'm here ain't I?).

I strongly believe that there are quite a few out there who are in
the 'state' I was five or six years ago. Just because the does not
seem to be that many on internet forums and such, does not mean there
aren't fans out there. I know a few people who just loved the movies
but could not be persuaded to visit a POTA forum. Even guys like Russo
himslef only pop up in forums once in a blue moon. Merchandise
purchases are an indicator, but even they are not completely accurate.
Some people are interested in books, but would not consider reading
comics. Some aren't interested in reading material at all and are
happy to have 'action figures'. And some people want to have
everything!

How many fans are out there? Depends on your definition. I don't think
that POTA fandom is that bleak. Otherwise there really wouldn't be ANY
new merchandise out there.

Would I buy another edition of Revisited? Only if it was significantly
altered with many additions to the original. A few extra photos are
not going to do it.

Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Whitty <whitty@...>
Date: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 1:37 am
Subject: RE: [PotaDG] Russo

> I would, but I have come to believe that there are about 250 POTA
fans
> in the world. So a book is probably doomed before it begins.
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of mlccougar@...
> Sent: Wednesday, 22 March 2006 2:55 PM
> To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Russo
>
> In a message dated 3/20/2006 2:16:11 AM Central Standard Time,
> whitty@... writes:
>
>
>
>
> Maybe he should explore a "pay to view" internet site.
>
>
>
>
> What good would that do? Wouldn't you rather have this stuff compiled
> into a book that you can look at anywhere, at your leisure (rather
> thanhaving to be glued in front of a monitor?)
>

F*ckin' Hippie. Go hug a tree. That show was funny. I'm down with
C.H.U.M.P. and when we take over the world... you tree huggers are
outa here. ;)

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Whitty" <whitty@...> wrote:
>
> What about the cruelty to animals issues???!?!?!?!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of Haristas@...
> Sent: Wednesday, 22 March 2006 10:30 AM
> To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Secret Chimp
>
> In a message dated 3/21/06 8:29:14 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> whitty@... writes:
>
>
>
>
> Thanks Jeff.
>
>
>
> Don't tell Rory! SHHHhhhhhhhhhhh.........
>
>
>
> Michael
>
>
> Too late! I'll be buying this. At least you don't have to pay a
> hundred bucks for a Lance Link head!
>
> -- Rory Link
>

The problem with Planet of the Apes fans isn't the number of them.
Its the fact that we are older, smarter, and don't live with our
parents all our lives so we can't devote our whole paycheck from
working at the game store in the mall to buying whatever piece of
crap George Lucas stamps Star Wars on. :) I think a good book with
lots of new photos that haven't been circulated over and over would
do well. Most Horror/SFX fans respect Planet of the Apes, as do alot
of the tattoo artist I've met. Marketed to the right people, I think
the book has potential to do well in those away from the mainstream
circles.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
>
> I don't know about that. As it happens, I was not very active in
POTA
> fandom when the Russo book came out. Sure I was a fan and had a few
> POTA collectibles and all that, but I was not active to the point
of
> even checking out if there were POTA discussion groups or POTA
sites.
>
> But even then, when I saw "Revisited" at the local bookstore, I
> immediately bought it (and it was NOT cheap!).
>
> Obviously, I've upped my interest and expanded my activities since
> then. (Hey, I'm here ain't I?).
>
> I strongly believe that there are quite a few out there who are in
> the 'state' I was five or six years ago. Just because the does not
> seem to be that many on internet forums and such, does not mean
there
> aren't fans out there. I know a few people who just loved the
movies
> but could not be persuaded to visit a POTA forum. Even guys like
Russo
> himslef only pop up in forums once in a blue moon. Merchandise
> purchases are an indicator, but even they are not completely
accurate.
> Some people are interested in books, but would not consider reading
> comics. Some aren't interested in reading material at all and are
> happy to have 'action figures'. And some people want to have
> everything!
>
> How many fans are out there? Depends on your definition. I don't
think
> that POTA fandom is that bleak. Otherwise there really wouldn't be
ANY
> new merchandise out there.
>
> Would I buy another edition of Revisited? Only if it was
significantly
> altered with many additions to the original. A few extra photos are
> not going to do it.
>
> Dario
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Whitty <whitty@...>
> Date: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 1:37 am
> Subject: RE: [PotaDG] Russo
>
> > I would, but I have come to believe that there are about 250 POTA
> fans
> > in the world. So a book is probably doomed before it begins.
> >
> > Michael
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com [PotaDG@yahoogroups.com ] On
> Behalf
> > Of mlccougar@...
> > Sent: Wednesday, 22 March 2006 2:55 PM
> > To: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Russo
> >
> > In a message dated 3/20/2006 2:16:11 AM Central Standard Time,
> > whitty@... writes:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Maybe he should explore a "pay to view" internet site.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > What good would that do? Wouldn't you rather have this stuff
compiled
> > into a book that you can look at anywhere, at your leisure
(rather
> > thanhaving to be glued in front of a monitor?)
> >
>

.html

Does anyone know when the new Reveloution hits the stands?

<.html

.html

In a message dated 3/22/2006 8:46:15 AM Central Standard Time, DrZaiusDavis@... writes:

The problem with Planet of the Apes fans isn't the number of them.
Its the fact that we are older, smarter, and don't live with our
parents all our lives so we can't devote our whole paycheck from
working at the game store in the mall to buying whatever piece of
crap George Lucas stamps Star Wars on. :)  I think a good book with
lots of new photos that haven't been circulated over and over would
do well. Most Horror/SFX fans respect Planet of the Apes, as do alot
of the tattoo artist I've met. Marketed to the right people, I think
the book has potential to do well in those away from the mainstream
circles. 

I don't know about that, I know that when the new apes game came out for the computer I ran and tracked my wife down like a little kid in the mall? It had been a long time since I felt that way. I seem to throw down a lot of money on all the apes stuff. Comics, toys, video games, DVD'S and so on. And I'm 39 now. Maybe I need to see a Doctor?

 

Tom

<.html

.html

In a message dated 3/22/2006 5:50:23 A.M. Central Standard Time, whitty@... writes:

Neil  

What the hell is THIS?!?!?

 

Must be Planet Of The Simpsons.

 

<.html

.html

In a message dated 3/22/2006 9:17:25 A.M. Central Standard Time, tshaf37@... writes:

I don't know about that, I know that when the new apes game came out for the computer

 

There's a new one?

Or you mean last year?

I have it for PC & PS2

and I can't get past the gorilla.

I need some cheats!

 

<.html

.html

 

Okay Neil...

If I don't see some

sketches soon . . .

I'll just have to

write some more!  ; )

 

 

 

<.html

I just found out yesterday that the local comic book store, the one
that I made sure ordered "Revolution" is going to close up by next
monday.

I was one of the first to find out these were coming. I was the one
that brought the news to the DG. I waited about six months after
hearing these comics were going to come out, to make SURE I would have
a source. I did everything right and now my 'supply' is in peril!

AAARRRGH!

Just venting some steam.

Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: tshaf37@...
Date: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 10:12 am
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Other new comics

> Does anyone know when the new Reveloution hits the stands?
>

.html

In a message dated 3/22/2006 10:15:05 A.M. Central Standard Time, darios@... writes:

I did everything right and now my 'supply' is in peril!

 

I got my copy over the Net.

 

 

<.html

Does anyone know when the new Reveloution hits the stands?

.html<.html

.html<.html

.html

 

If you hate Beneath you'll love this review ...

 

filmcritic.com Movie Review: Beneath the Planet of the Apes

<.html

.html

In a message dated 3/22/2006 2:51:38 P.M. Central Standard Time, LordTZer0@... writes:

If you hate Beneath you'll love this review ...

 

filmcritic.com Movie Review: Beneath the Planet of the Apes

 

Check out his other POTA reviews at the bottom of the page.

 

 

<.html

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:

>
> Just to be clear (before someone goes on ebay and buys a whole lot),
> Jack Kirby only worked on the initial Kamandi comics and it was

later

> passed on to other writers/artists. He did about half of them.
>
> Dario
>

Yeah Kirby's last issue was #40, although he'd been slowly pulling
away for awhile (no longer doing covers, stepped down as editor as of
#34, his last few issues other people scripted etc ) so the early ones
are certainly the best. DC comics have released a hard cover archive
edition of the first few issues. How's the book going Dario? does it
cover Kirby's last few years post his DC work inthe 70's
Best Graham.

.html

 

It's funny, but this reviewer seems to know

a lot about POTA and it's behinds the scenes

history, in spite of calling Zira, Kira in the review

of the first one, and saying that Taylor told Nova

to find Zaius in the second one.  Typical of a critic.

 

<.html

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , LordTZer0@... wrote:

>
> If you hate Beneath you'll love this review ...
>
> _filmcritic.com Movie Review: Beneath the Planet of the Apes_
>

(http://filmcritic.com/misc/emporium.nsf/0/8B22FBA41495B45388256A9A001
CF272/?OpenDocument)

Here's his worthless review, cut-&-pasted, with my comments in square
brackets [like this]:

-------------------------------------------------------------

Beneath the Planet of the Apes
A film review by Max Messier - Copyright © 2001 filmcritic.com Search
6,000+ reviews!

I guess when your budget gets slashed because of a string of previous
Twentieth Century Fox flops (down to $3 million this time out) and
your name is Arthur P. Jacobs, you do what you can to find a way to
make a sequel to one of Fox's biggest successes.

The main problem with making a sequel to the original Apes was that
Charlton Heston didn't want to put the loincloth back on to keep the
struggle going against those damn, dirty apes. So Richard Zanuck, the
producer of the original Apes, asked Heston personally to return to
the role as some kind of karmic payback for making thr original.
Heston took the role but insisted that Taylor be killed at the
beginning of the film. So Jacobs hired some schmuck who looked like
Heston, named James Franciscus, tossed him in a loincloth, told him
to growl like the great one, and then hopefully watch the sawbucks
pour in on opening weekend.

Beneath the Planet of the Apes doesn't just suck; it gives a new
meaning to the intolerable hell that sequels always seem to deliver.
The pace picks right back up with Taylor (Heston) and Nova (Zanuck's
girlfriend, still without uttering a single word of dialogue) riding
down the same sandy beach looking for a nice little alcove to hole up
and start producing their own colony of "talking humans." Before you
know it, Taylor and Nova are traveling through the desert and strange
storms appear across the sky. Taylor hops off the horse, tells Nova
to "find Dr. Zaius" if he gets into trouble, and then he suddenly
disappears into a rock wall. Huh? ["Huh?" is right -- he told her to
find ZIRA, not Zaius; doesn't this dipshit know the fucking
difference?]

Cut to: another astronaut from Earth's past – John Brent [Hmmm...
interesting... this jerk knows Brent's first name, even though it
isn't given ANYWHERE in the film; it's only found in the screenplay
and in Michael Avallone's novelization, which means that this
reviewer must have done SOME kind of research besides just watching
the movie and "BEHIND THE POTA"...](Franciscus) -- who has been sent
to find Taylor and his crew. After his ship crash lands, this
knucklehead runs into Nova, who then leads him to Cornelius and Zira
(Kim Hunter, the only ape to reprise her role) [Wha? What about
ZAIUS, you dillhole?]. Meanwhile, militant gorillas are amassing
public approval to venture into the Forbidden Zone (oooh!) to root
out some unknown evil that poises ["poises"? or POSES?] a viable
threat the survival of the ape race. Brent and Nova head off into the
Forbidden Zone to find Taylor and wind up in the subway tunnels of
New York, where they encounter a race of radioactive telepathic human
mutants. After the mutants capture Brent and Nova, they discover
Taylor, locked up in a jail cell, awaiting freedom from this godawful
film. Taylor, Brent, and Nova cleverly escape from the human mutants
as the gorilla army invades through subway tunnels. Main characters
die off one by one, the world gets blown to smithereens (courteous of
a suggestion by Heston himself), Nova utters her single memorable
line, and then this atrocity is brought to a close by one of the
boldest endings ever produced by a studio... ever.

Initially, Twentieth Century Fox was a bit timid about the original
production of Planet of the Apes mainly because of trepidation that
people would laugh their asses off at the sight of human actors
running around with monkey masks on. The makeup work of John Chambers
was exemplary in the first Apes production, but this time around,
most of the crowd scenes have people wearing ill-fitting rubber masks
that you usually find in the bargain bins of K-Mart. This problem
would only get worse as the sequels progressed.

The reflection of the discontent of the American populace at large
during the late sixties is strongly apparent by the use of pacifist
chimpanzees organizing non-violent sit-ins to protest the aggressive
actions of the gorilla armies and its zealous generals. Director Ted
Post even used handheld shots within the protest rallies to give
parts of the film an authentic documentary feel. But those efforts
actually feel cheap and forced, as if the studios were trying too
hard in their attempts to connect with a disfranchised viewing
audience.

Overall, this second go-round one-dimensional matte paintings, cheap
sets, and radioactive telepathic mutant humans is about as enjoyable
as giving your cat a bath. Still, I never thought I would see a G-
rated film with guns a-blazing, nuclear weapon explosions, and blood
sprayed across walls. Someone get Disney on the phone!

----------------------------------------------------------

Max Messier can kiss a gorilla's unshaved ass! Does he think his
readers have learned anything about "BENEATH" that they couldn't have
already read in a zillion other sources? All they got here was his
worthless opinion. So, he didn't like the flick. So the fuck what? I
think he's a penguin shit-eating ass-spelunker who fucks his uncle.

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , "Michael Whitty" <whitty@...> wrote:

> Neil
> What the hell is THIS?!?!?

-- Okay, here's the story. A while ago a bloke on eBay was selling T-
shirts with all different Futurama / Simpsons etc. stuff on them. One
was this picture (well a bit more, this is cropped) on a Futurama
shirt. I had to 'fix' up the foreground on it a fair bit as it had
writing plastered over much of it.

Neil

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:

> Isn't that ironic? A proposed storyline dealing with a 'Lazarus' and
> then the story dies, the one thing that cannot happen to the

character?

> Not sure what is happening with this. I thought it was going to be a
> group collaborative project.

-- Well you should be seeing something soon Re: T's Young Doctor Zira
script ? story. I'm pretty sure Mr. Whitty still remains keen to use
the name Lazarus and did want to work him into the YDZ story?

Neil

Hi Dario.

Yes, I wanted a group effort.  However, (as usual!) it seems when it all comes down to delivering the goods it will all fall apart!

However, T has a really good story.  Neil and I have been very much enjoying reading it and Neil has developed some storyboard....Neil, let's see 'em!

As for Lazarus, I do have a story for him.  There's a nice twist on the name too and it ties in with Dr Zaius.

If I can, I'll tie it in with T's story.

I can just tell you the story but it would ruin the surprise/twist......

Michael

--------- Original Message --------
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
To: "PotaDG@yahoogroups.com" <PotaDG@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Other new comics
Date: 23/03/06 11:43

Isn't that ironic? A proposed storyline dealing with a 'Lazarus' and
then the story dies, the one thing that cannot happen to the character?

Not sure what is happening with this. I thought it was going to be a
group collaborative project. I put in my two cents which was just the
suggestion that a character named Lazarus be used, with the intent to
develop the associated connotations to that name, but never heard
anyone else mention anything. Are people working on this in the
background now?

If not, how about some suggestions? Maybe even just another character
proposal to get the juices flowing.

Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: LordTZer0@...
Date: Monday, March 20, 2006 4:34 am
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Other new comics

>
> In a message dated 3/6/2006 5:32:29 P.M. Central Standard Time, 
> whitty@... writes:
>
> I'd like  to combine T's Zira story with a story about Zaius and 
> LAZARUS
>
>
> Lazarus . . . Lazarus!  Arise!
> Is the Lazarus storyline dead, or what?
>
>
>

---

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

•  Visit your group "PotaDG" on the web.
   
•  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
   PotaDG-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
   
•  .

---

--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by CyberOne E-Mail Spam and Virus Protection Service, and is believed to be clean from viruses. CyberOne accepts no responsibility for the content of messages in transit through our servers.
--
Suspected unsolicited commercial bulk messages
(SPAM) have been marked with {Spam?} tag in the subject line enabling you to filter them out
by using your mail software's filtering

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , "John" <DrZaiusDavis@...> wrote:

> F*ckin' Hippie. Go hug a tree.

-- I thought you were talking to me there for a second!
I loved Lancelot Link, especially the Band! Don't know if you have
ever seen them in other countries but in England we used to have
adverts on the tele for PG Tips tea bags which used a family of
talking chimps in 'human' situations like furniture removers etc.

They were really funny.

Neil

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , LordTZer0@... wrote:

> Okay Neil...
> If I don't see some
> sketches soon . . .
> I'll just have to
> write some more! ; )

-- Check your inbox!

Neil

NNNNNoooooooooooo!!!!!!   :)

--------- Original Message --------
From: PotaDG@yahoogroups.com
To: "PotaDG@yahoogroups.com" <PotaDG@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [PotaDG] Home Page Picture
Date: 23/03/06 13:56

 

Okay Neil...

If I don't see some

sketches soon . . .

I'll just have to

write some more!  ; )

 

 

 

--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by CyberOne E-Mail Spam and Virus Protection Service, and is believed to be clean from viruses. CyberOne accepts no responsibility for the content of messages in transit through our servers.
--
Suspected unsolicited commercial bulk messages
(SPAM) have been marked with {Spam?} tag in the subject line enabling you to filter them out
by using your mail software's filtering

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , Haristas@... wrote:

> This I like! I'd love a full-length Simpsons POTA comic!

-- Yeah that would be cool, I want to see that as well.

Neil

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , Greg Plonowski <urko3085@...> wrote:

> This weeks issue features the return of Mike Ploog's artwork and

the Terror on the Planet of the Apes storyline. It also has the
return of the letter column, last seen in issue 71.

-- As always, thanks Greg!

> Several weeks ago in issue 72 you saw the application for the

Official Planet of the Apes Fan Club. Now thanks to Mark Rogers
there are copies of the newsletters that were sent out by the club
available to download.

-- And a massive thanks to Mark Rodgers as well. As bad as these
newsletters may have been they certainly bring back a lot of happy
memories!
And did I see the name Mark Talbot - Butler in one of those
newsletters as a monthly winner of some contest? Hmmmm... heard that
name before somewhere!

Neil

As luck would have it I always post reviews of books I read (mostly SF
novels) on a local site here and I've already written a review for this one.
(Note that some of the stuff here was taken from posting I had already
made to the DG, so it will sound familiar in places.)

Here is my review:
----------

"Tales to Astonish" Ronin Ro (2004)

"Tales to Astonish", a title more reminiscent of an SF pulp magazine
from early era, is the story of Jack "King" Kirby.

Most fans of Science Fiction will have nurtured their interest in the
genre from an early age. If you are like many others including myself,
the initial dip into that ocean was partially on account of comics. The
splashy graphics were dominated by superheroes and their counterpart
super villains. We grew up with them and their battles became our
battles. Along the way we became increasingly attached to the artists
and writers who filled in the details for these alternate universes we
lived in. Irregardless of whether you were a "DC" person or a
"Marvellite", the comic industry heavyweights were well known to all,
even if you did not happen to be reading their particular titles at the
time.

Arguably, Stan Lee has been the one name synonymous with Marvel comics.
But at the same time, there has always one other person who's name
immediately trailed that of Lee, and that was Jack Kirby. The argument
as to who was more responsible for the renaissance and restructuring of
the entire industry based on the success of multitude of 60's Marvel
titles is an argument that wil live on as long as the stories
themselves. The Fantastic Four, The Hulk, Thor, Iron Man, the list goes
on and on.

Unfortunately, the battles behind the scenes pitting the two supreme
personages are as legendary as the battles they drew and scripted.

From his upbringing in a tough Brooklyn neighborhood, his start in the
comics business with Joe Simon as a partner, to his eventual position as
Marvel's premiere artist, TtA has it all. While his artistry seemed to
flow effortlessly from his hands, his battles over control,
renumeration, credit and the ability to pick and choose his own projects
was an evergrowing struggle for most of his career. Part of the problem
was the way Marvel ran it's business. Part of the reason was that
realistically someone as talented as himself had very few options other
than the 'big two' publishers.

The one surprising aspect highlighted by TtA is that as great as an
artist as he was, Jack himself never considered himself as an artist as
much as a storyteller. Yes he drew thousands of comic pages, but he
considered the work as a whole. He actually detested creating comic
covers because to him it was nothing more than a static depiction. And
it is his take on the artist being a storyteller that probably was one
of the reasons behind all the arguments as to who really 'wrote' all
those classic comics he drew. The book lists numerous artists and others
in the field at the time who support Jack's claims that the 'stories'
provided by Stan all those years amounted to little more than a few
notes. (At Marvel, the process was such that the art was drawn first and
the dialogue added later. But artists often included margin notes with
text for panels.)

Jack spent many years at Marvel (and earlier companies that eventually
became "Marvel") despite the growing feud. Stan Lee's often sarcastic
commentary in the "Bullpen" editorials are also clearly evident of the
contention when taken into context. But Jack resisted the jump to rival
DC by believing promises that things would be sorted out and he was in
line for hefty bonuses and residuals for past work. After he finally
made the jump, he found that his creativity was stiffled at DC as
everything decided there came down to the bottom line with respect to
current sales.

But even at DC, Jack had his successes, one of them being Kamandi. But
even Kamandi fostered controversy as many deemed it a ripoff of Planet
of the Apes (POTA). Jack says that he had the idea for Kamandi sometime
in the 50's. While trying to figure out what to do next at DC (the stuff
he really wanted to work on was not being well received), he mentioned
Kamandi to then editor Carmine
Infantino. Planet of the Apes of course had already been released as a
movie, but Jack claims that he had not even seen it. Infantino on the
other hand had seen POTA and loved it. It was Infantino that not only
reinforced the inclusion of many aspects of POTA into Kamandi, but he
insisted that the marquee Statue of Liberty (the climactic ending to
POTA) be used on the cover of Kamandi #1. Jack claims to have only
reluctantly gone along.

At a time when most artists drew one or two pages a day, Jack was still
drawing an incredible 4 pages a day nearing his 70's. But his age began
and health began to take it's toll. His first page, drawn while he was
still full of energy was always top notch. The second page was OK.
Things deteriorated by the third page, and the fourth was always the
worst. Also, by this time Jack had already deferred some things to be
drawn, such as logos on costumes and stuff like that, to his inker at
the time. Towards the end he tried to have the inker even do more
'corrections', but the inker balked at this as it was simply to much
work extra for him.

The book repeatedly mentions how Jack desperately wanted the medical
insurance he finally received when working on the Ruby-Spears animation
project, one of his last. He suffered from severe frostbite during WWII
and nearly lost his legs as a result. His health was failing and he even
had a heart bypass operation that he had to cover up as he was worried
that his income would suffer if word got out.

The concluding chapters of the book concentrate on his fight to get back
his art from Marvel which became a 'cause celebre' in the comic
industry. The book details the terrible things Marvel was doing to him.
While Marvel had actually begun to return art to other artists, Jack was
treated very differently because Marvel was standing on some very shaky
ground when it came to the actual copyright on those many Kirby
characters. So Marvel believed that the act of giving him back his own
art could then be used by him to later seek copyright ownership. It got
to the point that Kirby could no longer even go to a toy store as he
knew he would be surround by his many creations and he wasn't getting a
single penny for all that surrounded him. Jack was a victim of his own
success.

It should be noted that as a book about a comic book artist, the
distinct lack of any actual art other than the cover page stands as
testament to the art ownership conflicts. I wonder if the author or
publisher even attempted to enter into art copyright discussions with
anyone, lest they end up having to pay for some of the very people Jack
fought along the way.

An extremely enjoyable read but I would caution others that the book
might dispell any illusions that all the people working on those golden
age comics of our youth were all simply having a great time and lived
and worked in some mythical utopian industry. If you want to keep those
memories intact, then I would suggest that you get yourself some of
Jacks work, and just stick to reading that.


Dario

----- Original Message -----
From: hill19652000 <shop@...>
Date: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 4:22 pm
Subject: [PotaDG] Re: Kirby POTA cartoon concept sketch

> --- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, Dario Sciola <darios@...> wrote:
> >
> > Just to be clear (before someone goes on ebay and buys a whole
> lot),
> > Jack Kirby only worked on the initial Kamandi comics and it was
> later
> > passed on to other writers/artists. He did about half of them.
> >
> > Dario
> >
>
>
> Yeah Kirby's last issue was #40, although he'd been slowly
> pulling
> away for awhile (no longer doing covers, stepped down as editor as
> of
> #34, his last few issues other people scripted etc ) so the early
> ones
> are certainly the best. DC comics have released a hard cover
> archive
> edition of the first few issues. How's the book going Dario? does
> it
> cover Kirby's last few years post his DC work inthe 70's
> Best Graham.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

.html
-- <.html

.html
-- <.html

.html
-- <.html

I actually discussed pitching this crossover idea to both Fox and, well....Fox (in the form of Bongo Comics), but was convinced the fan base would number in the dozens!

Ty

.html
-- <.html

.html
-- <.html

.html<.html

It's been printed, it's all a matter of when the trucks take it to the stores.  The problem with getting it out on a regular basis are mostly to do with the size of our print run.  We get second tier status at the printers, when Marvel or DC books come in late, and stuff has to be shifted around, we always get the first shift.

In theory it should be out next wednesday, but I woulnd't quote me on that.

Ty

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 001.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20001.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 002.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20002.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 003.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20003.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Attachments :

.html <.html

Attachments :

Hey, I thought I'd toss out this ad for issue #6 that we just put together.  I'm tickled about it, so I'm sending it around.

Ty

Attachments :

.html <.html

Attachments :

.html <.html

Attachments :

.html <.html

Even Neil's storyboards are great. I hate you.... hippie. ;)

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com, "Neil T Foster" <nfoster@...> wrote:
>
> --
>
> Neil
>

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , "Ty Templeton" <tybunny@...> wrote:

> Hey, I thought I'd toss out this ad for issue #6 that we just put

together.

> I'm tickled about it, so I'm sending it around.

-- Very cool!

Neil

.html.html I have two questions about this...

1. Are you contractually obliged to use the modern POTA logo design, which is a slightly altered version of the original 1968 version?

2. Do you see the story in your REVOLUTION comic as a political aligory/social satire on the current state of an increasingly conservative America?  (Canada also recently elected a more conservative leadership.)

-- Rory<.html<.html

Hey all
If you missed out on the Sideshow Vision Lawgiver there is one on
ebay!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6046480678

.html

In a message dated 3/23/2006 8:29:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, JLKINSER1970@... writes:

Hey all
If you missed out on the Sideshow Vision Lawgiver there is one on
ebay!!!

 

If I wanted a bleeding Lawgiver

I think I could paint one better than that.

 

 

<.html

--- In PotaDG@yahoogroups.com , LordTZer0@... wrote:

>
>
> In a message dated 3/23/2006 8:29:37 P.M. Central Standard Time,
> JLKINSER1970@... writes:
>
> Hey all
> If you missed out on the Sideshow Vision Lawgiver there is one on
> ebay!!!
>
>
>
> If I wanted a bleeding Lawgiver
> I think I could paint one better than that.

I bought mine off of Ebay after Comic Con. I like him but you are
right in all you have to do is get the regular Lawgiver and slap some
paint on him and bam, you have him

>

.html <.html

We use the logos that Fox sent us.  So if it's the slightly modified version you're seeing on the covers of our mags, then that's the one we're using.  The logo on this 6th issue ad, by the way, is NOT the one we use on the printed covers, it's merely the one I used on this ad, which is a quickie image, never meant to be seen more than three inches high in a solicits magazine.  This happens to be the original "revolution" logo (which is slightly taller than the one we use on the printed covers) because it fit the space I had more comfortably.  Read nothing more into it than that.

Do I see the story in Revolution as political?  Hell yeah.  The story in Conquest and and the story in Planet are both highly political.  (Beneath, bless its heart, attempt to play with political satire, and came across as ham handed nonsense.)

I've said in many interviews, that the heart and soul of the better Apes movies (Planet, Conquest and Escape) is the deft blending of social satire, action adventure, and science fiction.  To remove any one of those elements is to do a disservice to the source material.

So, sure, we're doing politics, and right wing politics is clearly part of what we're messing with in our script since it's a part of our world, but by no means are we writing a polemic about Bush specificially.  Gosh no.  What would be the point of that?  It would instantly lock this story into 2006 (making it a dull read in a few years) and cheapen the Apes in general.  The society in Conquest is clearly a fascist state, built on slave labour and fear.  We extrapolated that government into our world, but were not consciously doing "Bush" when we designed these characters.  (If anything, Joe and I talked more about turning Governor Brent into a winking version of Arnold Schwartzenegger than we ever did about turning Trundy into Bush). 

Our President Trundy is a fear-mongering fool, who is clearly into "species hatred" in a parallel to 19th Century racism.  That's his tragic flaw, not an addiction to oil. Trundy is also a preening stuffed shirt, which I suppose is Bush-like....but it's mostly his inabilty to see Apes as equals (and all that that entails) that is at the center of Trundy's character when I write his dialouge and scenes.  Though he carries many many faults, I don't consciously see Bush as a racist (I think he disregards the rights of everyone equally).  Nixon, however, was a screaming racist.  A mind boggling racist.  A drinking beer while holding a shotgun and wearing the white sheets style racist.  Listening to Nixon rant about the mud peoples will make you physically ill.

I don't equate racism, censorship and totalitarianism as right wing politics so much as I see them as the standard behaviour of political villains in genre fiction for decades.   SEE:  Good Night and Good Luck, V for Vendetta, Conquest of the Planet of the Apes, 1984, etc. 

Perhaps Bush behaves more and more like a genre villain as the months drag on, and it's hard to do political satire WITHOUT seeming to be aiming at him, but I promise, Joe and I wrote this to be iconic political satire, and not specific political satire, and primarily, we tried to stay true to the backstory of the political world of the Apes movies.

Ty the Guy.

Thanks for that question.  I wonder if we might print it in our letters page in issue #4?

Editor Ty.

Tom Fowler, coloured by Bernie Mireault, yup.  It's actually interior art (from #4,) I think.  But it made for a cool ad, so we're running it on a website or two to promote the solicitation of #6 (which starts next month, I think).

Ty

Hey, anyone want to see the final cover art for #4?  It just came in last week, and it's SO cool!!  (like you're going to say no...)

Again Ty.

.html

 

What happened with that Typhoon?

I heard it was the worst since the 70's!

 

 

<.html

.html
-- <.html

.html
-- <.html

.html

In a message dated 3/24/2006 1:27:06 A.M. Central Standard Time, whitty@... writes:

The one in Queensland , Down Under?

 

Yeah, in the Northeast.

I think it was called Larry.

Curly must have already

hit.  Next comes Moe,

then Shemp!

 

 

 

<.html

.html.html In a message dated 3/24/06 1:39:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, tybunny@... writes:

Our President Trundy is a fear-mongering fool

If that ain't Bush, what is?

Thanks for that question.  I wonder if we might print it in our letters page in issue #4?

Editor Ty.

I haven't a problem with that.  I'll never see it.  Haven't seen one issue!  Just not into comics, but I like that you're trying for more than just an "adventure among the monkeys."

-- Rory<.html <.html

.html <.html

.html.html washingtonpost.com:

'The Simpsons' to Show Live-Action Opening
The Associated Press
Friday, March 24, 2006; 1:27 AM

NEW YORK -- Ever wonder what Bart Simpson would look like in human form? The longrunning animated Fox series "The Simpsons" is about to show you. The series will unveil a live-action opening sequence Sunday, 8 p.m. EST, a Fox spokeswoman announced Thursday.

In it, the dysfunctional cartoon family _ Bart, Homer, Marge, Lisa and Maggie _ will be seen as they would appear in real life, played by lookalike actors.

"I'm just amazed there are people who want to be known for looking like the Simpsons," said Al Jean, the show's executive producer, in a statement.

A team from British network Sky One created and commissioned the live sequence, which apes the long-running series' memorable opening shots: Bart writing on the chalkboard, Homer pulling the nuclear rod out of his shirt and Maggie and Marge at the supermarket, a Fox spokeswoman said.

"The Simpsons" was recently renewed for two more seasons, its 18th and 19th.



<.html<.html

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 005.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20005.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 004.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20004.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Attachments :

.html <.html

Attachments :

.html <.html

.html

Reminder from the Calendar of PotaDG Mort Abrahams' Birthday Sunday March 26, 2006 All Day This event repeats every year. Notes: Happy Birthday Mort! Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting Find Gifts Browse Yahoo! Shopping's Gift Guide

Copyright ©  2006  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved.

<.html

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 006.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20006.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Attachments :

.html <.html

Attachments :

.html <.html

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 007.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20007.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Attachments :

.html <.html

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the PotaDG
group.

File : /Comics/Young Dr Zira/YDZ 008.gif
Uploaded by : munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>
Description :

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PotaDG/files/Comics/Young%20Dr%20Zira/YDZ%20008.gif

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

munkeyman63au <nfoster@...>

Attachments :

.html

 

Actually Young Doctor Zira is just a working title.

You know . . . Like Young Doctor Kildare.  I was

going to call it Before The Planet Of The Apes,

or has that title been used already?

 

<.html

.html

In a message dated 3/27/2006 7:34:22 A.M. Central Standard Time, urko3085@... writes:

I've been enjoying this story so far. I like the sketchy style Neil is using. This is supposed to be breakdowns, right? Or storyboards?

 

Yeah, I've been thinking Neil has released a bit too much.

But I am glad to hear positive feedback on it.  But Neil,

hold back a bit.  Let's not give everything away just yet.

 

<.html